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Welcome to the NEW RLFANS.COM. After twenty-five years of service, the old site expired over the last few days. To maintain service we have had no option but to make an early switch to the new site which was in development/testing. Some elements of the new site are unfinished, such as; page numbering and quotations. We will fix these minor issues as soon as we can, please bear with us.
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| Rank | Posts | Team |
| International Chairman | 1016 | No
Team
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| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Dec 2001 | 23 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Jan 2015 | Jan 2013 | LINK |
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Quote ="William Eve"How about the full time-frame comparsion (1998-2012) as opposed to your selective 5 year one?
<snipped>
And the comparison suddenly becomes earth-shatteringly different
 icon_cool.gif" alt="icon_cool.gif" title="Cool" />'"
SL and the NRL operate in different markets with different market conditions. A more like-for-like comparison could be to compare the Pre-SL Championship in 1995 to Super League in 2012.
RL Championship 1988-1995
1 club (Wigan) won
* 7 Cup and League doubles
* An additional League
* 5 League Cups
* 3 World Club Challenge titles
Super League 1996 onwards
* 4 Grand Final winners
* 6 clubs to play in the Grand Final
* 5 League Leaders
* 7 clubs to win the Challenge Cup
* 10 clubs to reach the Cup final
* 3 English clubs winning the WCC |
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Quote ="William Eve"How about the full time-frame comparsion (1998-2012) as opposed to your selective 5 year one?
<snipped>
And the comparison suddenly becomes earth-shatteringly different
icon_cool.gif" alt="icon_cool.gif" title="Cool" />'"
SL and the NRL operate in different markets with different market conditions. A more like-for-like comparison could be to compare the Pre-SL Championship in 1995 to Super League in 2012.
RL Championship 1988-1995
1 club (Wigan) won
* 7 Cup and League doubles
* An additional League
* 5 League Cups
* 3 World Club Challenge titles
Super League 1996 onwards
* 4 Grand Final winners
* 6 clubs to play in the Grand Final
* 5 League Leaders
* 7 clubs to win the Challenge Cup
* 10 clubs to reach the Cup final
* 3 English clubs winning the WCC | |
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| Rank | Posts | Team |
| International Board Member | 20966 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Aug 2003 | 22 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Jun 2015 | Feb 2015 | LINK |
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TO BE FIXED |
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Quote ="JB Down Under"Why is income from fans any more stable than income from a rich owner/director? Fan bases fluctuate depending on results and economics of the area. There are no guarantees income from fans will remain the same each ">year.'"
If you don't link it to tangibles like fan revenue, youmay as well just doaway with the cap,as rich owners will simply buy trophies......as I said, Viable Business plans, not projections and the like.
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Quote ="JB Down Under"Why is income from fans any more stable than income from a rich owner/director? Fan bases fluctuate depending on results and economics of the area. There are no guarantees income from fans will remain the same each ">year.'"
If you don't link it to tangibles like fan revenue, youmay as well just doaway with the cap,as rich owners will simply buy trophies......as I said, Viable Business plans, not projections and the like.
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| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Club Owner | 33944 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Mar 2004 | 21 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Mar 2016 | Mar 2016 | LINK |
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Quote ="gutterfax"FWIW, depending on what figure you use, the break even attendance needed at most SL clubs is 10,000 a game.
Very rough maths are:
SKY 1.3 MILL
10K ave @25 notes each (tickets and residuals) 3.25 mill
Sponsorship, corporates advertising etc...half a millio
5 Million turn over and you should be allowed spend 20% of anything over that OVER THE CAP.
Clubs averaging over 10k a week will have an unfair advantage to start with, but by christ, you'd see a different kind of investor buying into the so called "smaller clubs", because for all the talk of the recession and times being hard, once you get fans used to coming to games, they will keep coming back.
Rough estimate id that Ian Lenagan has added 3k a match to the pie average over 5 years....something like 20% increase in attendances and about 15% in turn over.....smart businessmen are what's needed, not sugar daddy's'"
No, no, NO, a ' special relationship ' with your landlord is what you need, Leigh have a ' plan ' that would allow them to be competitive in SL on attendances of 3,500 icon_wink.gif" alt="icon_wink.gif" title="Wink" /> |
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Quote ="gutterfax"FWIW, depending on what figure you use, the break even attendance needed at most SL clubs is 10,000 a game.
Very rough maths are:
SKY 1.3 MILL
10K ave @25 notes each (tickets and residuals) 3.25 mill
Sponsorship, corporates advertising etc...half a millio
5 Million turn over and you should be allowed spend 20% of anything over that OVER THE CAP.
Clubs averaging over 10k a week will have an unfair advantage to start with, but by christ, you'd see a different kind of investor buying into the so called "smaller clubs", because for all the talk of the recession and times being hard, once you get fans used to coming to games, they will keep coming back.
Rough estimate id that Ian Lenagan has added 3k a match to the pie average over 5 years....something like 20% increase in attendances and about 15% in turn over.....smart businessmen are what's needed, not sugar daddy's'"
No, no, NO, a ' special relationship ' with your landlord is what you need, Leigh have a ' plan ' that would allow them to be competitive in SL on attendances of 3,500 icon_wink.gif" alt="icon_wink.gif" title="Wink" /> | |
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| Rank | Posts | Team |
| International Chairman | 18072 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Feb 2002 | 23 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Feb 2025 | Feb 2025 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
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| Milestone Years |
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TO BE FIXED |
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Quote ="The Observer"Farrell is highly regarded in RU circles for his coaching ability. Lancaster may not have lifted Leeds off the foot of the premiership, but he had to work with a team promoted from the Championship, which has consistently struggled in the Premiership. Compare Leeds RU's players with those of teams like Leicester and Saracens.
As for Lancaster's competition, he won the job over Nick Mallett, the former South Africa Springboks coach who won a record 17 tests in a row. Fellow former Springbok coach Jake White (World Cup winner in 2007) expressed interest. England could also have gone for world class coaches like NZer Vern Cotter (took French club Clermont to 4 consecutive finals, winning the 4th) or Australian Michael Cheika (won a Celtic League and European Cup title with irish province Leinster).
Lancaster and Farrell coached their side well enough to beat the All Blacks last year, which hasn't been done since August last year.
Farrell would not get into the All Black or Wallaby sides. However, nor would any of the other NH playmakers or Springboks for that matter. Furthermore, which England RL playmakers would get into the Kangaroos? None. It is immaterial, as Farrell would only need contend for a place in the England RU or RL teams, and would compete well for a ">place.'"
On Farrell being well regarded - so is Mick Ford, Neil Kelly etc they hardly starred in RL and if they could get a job in RL they would be back in a shot. Noble is another one - no one in RL wants to give him a job but he can get work in RU.
England have never had a foreign coach so Lancaster was not really competing with Mallet as you well know. You mentioned Leeds struggling the point of a good coach is to get the best out of the players - can you really say that about Lancaster's time at Leeds?
The point about Farrell was would he be any good in RL - the answer to that is no - he speed of thought is too slow - in RL he would be much closer to the line his decision making would have to quicken considerably also how would he defend against big centres two/three times in a set!!
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Quote ="The Observer"Farrell is highly regarded in RU circles for his coaching ability. Lancaster may not have lifted Leeds off the foot of the premiership, but he had to work with a team promoted from the Championship, which has consistently struggled in the Premiership. Compare Leeds RU's players with those of teams like Leicester and Saracens.
As for Lancaster's competition, he won the job over Nick Mallett, the former South Africa Springboks coach who won a record 17 tests in a row. Fellow former Springbok coach Jake White (World Cup winner in 2007) expressed interest. England could also have gone for world class coaches like NZer Vern Cotter (took French club Clermont to 4 consecutive finals, winning the 4th) or Australian Michael Cheika (won a Celtic League and European Cup title with irish province Leinster).
Lancaster and Farrell coached their side well enough to beat the All Blacks last year, which hasn't been done since August last year.
Farrell would not get into the All Black or Wallaby sides. However, nor would any of the other NH playmakers or Springboks for that matter. Furthermore, which England RL playmakers would get into the Kangaroos? None. It is immaterial, as Farrell would only need contend for a place in the England RU or RL teams, and would compete well for a ">place.'"
On Farrell being well regarded - so is Mick Ford, Neil Kelly etc they hardly starred in RL and if they could get a job in RL they would be back in a shot. Noble is another one - no one in RL wants to give him a job but he can get work in RU.
England have never had a foreign coach so Lancaster was not really competing with Mallet as you well know. You mentioned Leeds struggling the point of a good coach is to get the best out of the players - can you really say that about Lancaster's time at Leeds?
The point about Farrell was would he be any good in RL - the answer to that is no - he speed of thought is too slow - in RL he would be much closer to the line his decision making would have to quicken considerably also how would he defend against big centres two/three times in a set!!
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| Rank | Posts | Team |
| International Chairman | 18072 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Feb 2002 | 23 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Feb 2025 | Feb 2025 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
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| Milestone Years |
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| Location |
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| Signature |
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TO BE FIXED |
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Quote ="JB Down Under"Why is income from fans any more stable than income from a rich owner/director? Fan bases fluctuate depending on results and economics of the area. There are no guarantees income from fans will remain the same each ">year.'"
Greater spread - if one owner goes he takes it all - it is unlikely you whole crowd would go on mass. Most clubs will have fans who have been going considerably longer than any of the owners have owned the club.
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Quote ="JB Down Under"Why is income from fans any more stable than income from a rich owner/director? Fan bases fluctuate depending on results and economics of the area. There are no guarantees income from fans will remain the same each ">year.'"
Greater spread - if one owner goes he takes it all - it is unlikely you whole crowd would go on mass. Most clubs will have fans who have been going considerably longer than any of the owners have owned the club.
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| Rank | Posts | Team |
| Club Owner | 14082 | No
Team
Selected |
| Joined | Service | Reputation |
| Apr 2004 | 21 years | |
| Online | Last Post | Last Page |
| Feb 2017 | Feb 2017 | LINK |
| Milestone Posts |
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| Milestone Years |
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| Location |
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| Signature |
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TO BE FIXED |
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Quote ="Sal Paradise"Greater spread - if one owner goes he takes it all - it is unlikely you whole crowd would go on mass. Most clubs will have fans who have been going considerably longer than any of the owners have owned the ">club.'"
True but you lose 2000 fans and your losses become just as great as most owners (London aside) are putting in each year, and it's not unheard of to have avg attendance fluctuations of 2000 a season depending on performance.
gutterfax's scenario also doesn't take into account expense. One club could have 4mill income and be more profitable than a club with 5 mill income depending on how much they are spending on ground hire, coaches, directors scouting trips to Australia etc.
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Quote ="Sal Paradise"Greater spread - if one owner goes he takes it all - it is unlikely you whole crowd would go on mass. Most clubs will have fans who have been going considerably longer than any of the owners have owned the ">club.'"
True but you lose 2000 fans and your losses become just as great as most owners (London aside) are putting in each year, and it's not unheard of to have avg attendance fluctuations of 2000 a season depending on performance.
gutterfax's scenario also doesn't take into account expense. One club could have 4mill income and be more profitable than a club with 5 mill income depending on how much they are spending on ground hire, coaches, directors scouting trips to Australia etc.
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icon_cool.gif" alt="icon_cool.gif" title="Cool" />'"
