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| Quote Cronus="Cronus"You're forming an opinion based on heresay and...well, little else.
You're assuming all wealthy kids do naff all with their lives, when in my experience the opposite is true. Thanks to an accident of my location as a kid I know a lot of wealthy families and the majority of their kids have taken advantage of their, well, advantage, and have gone through the education system to its max, and are now occupying excellent jobs. Yes, many went the other way - many are in dead end jobs, some are in prison, some have realised the error of their ways and are now working to better themselves, but isn't that true of any sector of society?
And besides, I work to put food on the table and to provide a few luxuries. If a mysterious Aunt suddenly dumped several millions in my account, I'd jack in my job before you could say "Lee Briers lives in a caravan" and take as much time off as I wanted. Then I would use my wealth to fund an occupation I enjoyed. Perhaps I'd open a chain of restaurants. Or a couple of nice cosmopolitan bars to my tastes. Perhaps I'd try and dispose of my fortune and buy Salford. Whatever.
Most of us work because we have to. If we had the means not to, I'm sure many of us would ease off on the work front, or quit completely. And let's not tell idealistic porkies and pretend we wouldn't.'" Agreed and if you didn't work you would be burning through the cash you were sat on.
So the monies would be entering the economy/Tax pile through purchases and VAT, Fuel duty etc anyway.
Some seem to think that it is magic money that doesn't get spent if you don't work.
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| Quote Cronus="Cronus"Who begrudges people working hard to earn a lot of money? I don't. Good luck to 'em.
But it's their money, it gets taxed, and it's theirs to do what they like with. If some kids end up inheriting millions what's the problem? It's not like they'll be a drain on resources, is it? If they choose to sit in a big house and party for the next 60 years, who cares? Meanwhile, many of the wealthy will actually go on to create or sustain businesses and jobs.
If it's the last will & testament of the deceased to pass on their wealth - money they have earned and paid tax on - why is it anyone else's business? Smells fishily of jealousy.'"
Little to do with jealousy and everything to do with one of my main mantras in life - if you've earnt it you should as far as possible be allowed to keep it (and conversely if you haven't earnt it you better have a very good reason why you should have it).
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International Chairman | 47951 | No Team Selected |
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| Quote Anakin Skywalker="Anakin Skywalker"Agreed and if you didn't work you would be burning through the cash you were sat on.
So the monies would be entering the economy/Tax pile through purchases and VAT, Fuel duty etc anyway.
Some seem to think that it is magic money that doesn't get spent if you don't work.'"
I suspect what he's thinking of is the story from July about £13 trillion salted away in tax havens by the über rich global elite. Money taken out of the general economy – and economically inactive right now.
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International Chairman | 14845 | No Team Selected |
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| Quote Cronus="Cronus"You're forming an opinion based on heresay and...well, little else.
You're assuming all wealthy kids do naff all with their lives, when in my experience the opposite is true. Thanks to an accident of my location as a kid I know a lot of wealthy families and the majority of their kids have taken advantage of their, well, advantage, and have gone through the education system to its max, and are now occupying excellent jobs. Yes, many went the other way - many are in dead end jobs, some are in prison, some have realised the error of their ways and are now working to better themselves, but isn't that true of any sector of society?
And besides, I work to put food on the table and to provide a few luxuries. If a mysterious Aunt suddenly dumped several millions in my account, I'd jack in my job before you could say "Lee Briers lives in a caravan" and take as much time off as I wanted. Then I would use my wealth to fund an occupation I enjoyed. Perhaps I'd open a chain of restaurants. Or a couple of nice cosmopolitan bars to my tastes. Perhaps I'd try and dispose of my fortune and buy Salford. Whatever.
Most of us work because we have to. If we had the means not to, I'm sure many of us would ease off on the work front, or quit completely. And let's not tell idealistic porkies and pretend we wouldn't.'"
It's not about jealousy it is about merit and reward. We are indoctrinated with the idea you get out what you put in. This was manifested in the "American Dream" where people could work hard and improve their lot. The American Dream is no longer because those who have made it have detroyed the dynamism (like they did long ago here) by taking all the good positions, ensuring access to the best facilities, etc by pricing the poorer out.
I would much rather live in a society where every generation has to live the dream for themselves, where they can improve their lot, give their kids a good upbringing, amass a fortune if they wish but then leave it all to philanthropic causes (voluntarily but by tax if necessary). Imagine what a great and vibrant society we'sd have them. Constant striving. Well endowed hospitals, universities, arts, etc - and all without recourse to the public purse. Taxation could be extremely low too.
The problem is the rich and powerful create the rules to suit themselves and their selfishness. Also why should anyone own land? Land is a nautral resource. Everyone should only be able to lease from the nation. Leases should be capped at, say, 80 years (equivalent to a good adult life-span). That would ensure that property acquisition does not hamper real economic activity, allow for freer movement of labour, etc.
Let's have rampant, beneficial capitalism rather than current nonsense. The logic of the current system is that one family will eventually own everything and the rest just given enough to survive (maybe). A return to feudalism in effect.
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| Quote Dally="Dally"... Let's have rampant, beneficial capitalism rather than current nonsense ...'"
What do you imagine we have now, other than rampant, laissez-faire capitalism?
And unless you create some form of controls, then someone will always end up with more – and be able to use that extra money to make more at the expense of others.
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| On a related matter: look at this hypocrite, [url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-19487985condemning people for 'not working hard enough' or for a low enough wage (like them there Africans)[/url, when she had to work oh so hard to inherit her family's wealth.
And that's not 'envy'.
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| Quote The Video Ref="The Video Ref" ... The majority of tax is paid by a very small percentage of the population...'"
The majority of income is accrued by the same very small percentage of the population, that's why.
Quote The Video Ref="The Video Ref" ... Many people make no positive financial contribution through income tax whatsoever. Something for people to think about before shouting out loud to 'tax the rich'. ..'"
Many of the richest people in the country do nothing themselves.
Is the Duke of Westminster an entrepreneur? I think not.
Also, the gap between the two ends of the income distribution is widening all the time, the rich are getting richer, the poor are getting poorer and it's time to redress this.
If you want those at the bottom to pay more tax, they will need to be paid higher wages first.
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International Chairman | 47951 | No Team Selected |
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| Quote El Barbudo="El Barbudo"... If you want those at the bottom to pay more tax, they will need to be paid higher wages first.'"
And if that happened, not only would such people be paying more tax (including through VAT) but would also be costing less in in-work benefits – or taxpayer subsidies to business, as they should be correctly called.
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International Chairman | 14522 | No Team Selected |
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| Quote Cronus="Cronus"Who begrudges people working hard to earn a lot of money? I don't. Good luck to 'em.
But it's their money, it gets taxed, and it's theirs to do what they like with. If some kids end up inheriting millions what's the problem? It's not like they'll be a drain on resources, is it? If they choose to sit in a big house and party for the next 60 years, who cares? Meanwhile, many of the wealthy will actually go on to create or sustain businesses and jobs.
If it's the last will & testament of the deceased to pass on their wealth - money they have earned and paid tax on - why is it anyone else's business? Smells fishily of jealousy.'"
I guess you mean envy.
As the rich are getting richer and the poor are getting poorer, climbing out of poverty gets harder and harder.
The talented from humble backgrounds have to compete with those who are often less-talented but better-educated and much better-funded and consequently, more confident.
A financial risk on a limited income is much, much harder to face than it is when you know damn well that your family fortune is big enough to not even feel the impact if the risk fails.
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| Quote Mintball="Mintball"On a related matter: look at this hypocrite, [url=http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-19487985condemning people for 'not working hard enough' or for a low enough wage (like them there Africans)[/url, when she had to work oh so hard to inherit her family's wealth.
And that's not 'envy'.'"
So, if the key to increasing personal wealth is to quit smoking & drinking and simply work harder for less, without moaning. Why isn't Africa bursting at the seams with millionaire women?
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| Quote Mintball="Mintball"What do you imagine we have now, other than rampant, laissez-faire capitalism?'"
Go on I'll bite - which industries do you think currently run under laissez-faire capitalism?
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International Chairman | 14845 | No Team Selected |
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| Quote Diavolo Rosso="Diavolo Rosso"Go on I'll bite - which industries do you think currently run under laissez-faire capitalism?'"
Banking (one of our "success" stories (ha, ha))- largely nationalised.
NHS - (largest 'er) - public
Railways - heavily subsided
Car industry - large subsidies to foreign companies
Pharmaceutical manufacture - subsidised via NHS
A large "third sector" - hardly rampant capatalism there
Hi - tech manufacturing - propped up by MoD
We're basically left with professional services as the bastions of capitalism - and they are dependent on the above! So, as I have said before we are effectively living in the socialist utopia that the Labour party always used to aspire to. Mintball has lost the plot with that statement!
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