FORUMS FORUMS




  

Home The Sin Bin Brexit Anyone ? (part 3)



Post new topic This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 1405 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 96, 97, 98, 99, 100, 101, 102 ... 141  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 9:50 am 
Club Captain
Fringe Player

Joined: Jan 25 2019
Posts: 783
Mild Rover wrote:Yeah, it’s noticeable that the Brexiteers talk in terms of the 17.4 million, which is legitimate and accurate, more than 52%, which is a majority but a narrow one. Obviously sufficient for Brexit, but not necessarily their preferred version of it.

I understand May’s instinct to try to firm up her base in the parliamentary Conservative party, having lost her majority. However, once the extent of the recalcitrance of the ERG became clear, the arithmetic became impossible for her. She chose holding that ship together rather building a cross-party consensus around a softer Brexit. In fairness, she might well have been chucked overboard if she’d tried the latter. But there was an element of personal pride in there as well, imo - in that she just couldn’t bring herself to ‘go crawling’ to Corbyn and Labour.

I've long argued that 50.1% is a majority, but only if they vote for what the people calling the vote want, apparently.

Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 10:12 am 
Club Coach
Club Coach
User avatar

Joined: Mar 24 2010
Posts: 15521
Location: Ossett
There are much more grown up ways to hold referenda, and they are used around the world, but we chose a politically illiterate binary option on one of the most significant political decision for several generations - it was always going to end badly, especially when, as someone else pointed out, the two sides were not aligned with party lines. I guess we have David Cameron and his advisers to thank for that - but as Danny Dyer so eloquently said, "Where is the geezer?"

I can't see May lasting until the end of the week - and in some ways, she could salvage a minor scrap of credibility by throwing her hands in the air and saying, "I tried - but the HoC wouldn't play ball." She'll then sail off into the sunset with Philip's arms deals £billions to scrape by on, and the Johnson's and Rees-Moggs will be left to face the ire of the electorate.

I want a GE - but I fail to see how even that could bridge the divide; there is no consensus for anything in Parliament other than Remain, but a tiny majority of those who voted will never accept that, because they won, and they want their prize - even if they don't know what the prize is, and it's actually a different prize for every Leave voter you talk to.

Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 10:18 am 
Player Coach
Club Captain
User avatar

Joined: Oct 26 2005
Posts: 3829
Location: In the seaside town ...that they forgot to bomb
MGarbutt1986 wrote:so, under WTO rules, cars from Europe go up £1500, beef goes up 52% etc etc etc, the leave campaign never told us any of this!


No, because we had the likes of Liam Fox stating that "the Brexit deal would be the easiest thing in human history".

Also, a couple of months before the referendum, that trusty ally Gove stated "the day after we vote leave, we hold all the cards & we can choose the path we want."






In Springfield, they're eating the dogs, the people that came in. They're eating the cats! They're eating the pets!

Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 10:36 am 
Club Captain
Fringe Player

Joined: Jan 25 2019
Posts: 783
The Devil's Advocate wrote:No, because we had the likes of Liam Fox stating that "the Brexit deal would be the easiest thing in human history".

Also, a couple of months before the referendum, that trusty ally Gove stated "the day after we vote leave, we hold all the cards & we can choose the path we want."

I must admit, I am torn, the majority voted leave, but didn't know what a shambles it would be, so maybe a second vote, with (as bren2k has said) a less binary set of options, might be needed.

Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 11:20 am 
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Dec 22 2001
Posts: 32068
Location: The Corridor of Uncertainty
bren2k wrote:I want a GE - but I fail to see how even that could bridge the divide; there is no consensus for anything in Parliament other than Remain, but a tiny majority of those who voted will never accept that, because they won, and they want their prize - even if they don't know what the prize is, and it's actually a different prize for every Leave voter you talk to.


And that’s why we have an insoluble problem. A GE won’t change a thing because parties would remain split and their respective policy on Brexit would dominate the election campaign and skew the whole thing. Brexit needs to be sorted first. If MPs can’t put aside political ambitions and agree on a cross party consensus along a customs union/Norway option then it could be another referendum with a less binary question.

What question you put and the options is another argument in itself and likely to get all the extremists on all sides crying foul. As I see it there is Hard Brexit (No deal), Soft Brexit (Norway) and Remain as options. Or if you want to respect the referendum result you could issue a choice between Hard Brexit (No deal) and Soft Brexit (Norway).

The trouble is that it could again be a very slim majority for an option that has enormous ramifications.

Anyone now think referendums aren’t always the best way of solving an issue? Special thanks must go to the right wing of the Tory Party for getting us here.






"If you start listening to the fans it won't be long before you're sitting with them," - Wayne Bennett.

Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 11:24 am 
Player Coach
Academy Player

Joined: May 30 2009
Posts: 455
Location: Warrington
Bullseye wrote:And that’s why we have an insoluble problem. A GE won’t change a thing because parties would remain split and their respective policy on Brexit would dominate the election campaign and skew the whole thing. Brexit needs to be sorted first. If MPs can’t put aside political ambitions and agree on a cross party consensus along a customs union/Norway option then it could be another referendum with a less binary question.

What question you put and the options is another argument in itself and likely to get all the extremists on all sides crying foul. As I see it there is Hard Brexit (No deal), Soft Brexit (Norway) and Remain as options. Or if you want to respect the referendum result you could issue a choice between Hard Brexit (No deal) and Soft Brexit (Norway).

The trouble is that it could again be a very slim majority for an option that has enormous ramifications.

Anyone now think referendums aren’t always the best way of solving an issue? Special thanks must go to the right wing of the Tory Party for getting us here.

Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 11:25 am 
Club Captain
Fringe Player

Joined: Jan 25 2019
Posts: 783
Bullseye wrote:Anyone now think referendums aren’t always the best way of solving an issue? Special thanks must go to the right wing of the Tory Party for getting us here.


And all the old, racist people that voted leave.

Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 11:29 am 
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Dec 22 2001
Posts: 32068
Location: The Corridor of Uncertainty
MGarbutt1986 wrote:And all the old, racist people that voted leave.


I’ve more of an axe to grind with those that thought a referendum would solve the issue “once and for all” and those who agitated for it since 1974. Looking at the characters involved they weren’t all old and/or racist. They were all Tories though.






"If you start listening to the fans it won't be long before you're sitting with them," - Wayne Bennett.

Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 11:31 am 
Player Coach
Academy Player

Joined: May 30 2009
Posts: 455
Location: Warrington
Bullseye wrote:And that’s why we have an insoluble problem. A GE won’t change a thing because parties would remain split and their respective policy on Brexit would dominate the election campaign and skew the whole thing. Brexit needs to be sorted first. If MPs can’t put aside political ambitions and agree on a cross party consensus along a customs union/Norway option then it could be another referendum with a less binary question.

What question you put and the options is another argument in itself and likely to get all the extremists on all sides crying foul. As I see it there is Hard Brexit (No deal), Soft Brexit (Norway) and Remain as options. Or if you want to respect the referendum result you could issue a choice between Hard Brexit (No deal) and Soft Brexit (Norway).

The trouble is that it could again be a very slim majority for an option that has enormous ramifications.

Anyone now think referendums aren’t always the best way of solving an issue? Special thanks must go to the right wing of the Tory Party for getting us here.


Your right, I really want us to leave the EU, however, I don't think I could stand this embarrassment much longer, like you I don't know what a GE will achieve, until recently all Labour would say is that everything is on the table. I might be wrong but I think our only option now is another divisive referendum. I also agree its just what the question will be :?

Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Brexit Anyone ? (part 3)
PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 11:33 am 
Club Coach
Club Coach
User avatar

Joined: Mar 24 2010
Posts: 15521
Location: Ossett
MGarbutt1986 wrote:And all the old, racist people that voted leave.


Tempted to quote Stewart Lee here - but I don't want to get banned.

You're not far wrong though - a lot of people voted leave because they were exercised about FoM - fuelled by lies and rhetoric, which convinced them that all the things that were wrong in their lives, were caused by immigration.

As Will Self said the other day in his real-time humiliation of Mark Francois, not everyone who voted leave were racists, but most racists probably voted to leave.

Top
   
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 1405 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1 ... 96, 97, 98, 99, 100, 101, 102 ... 141  Next





It is currently Thu Feb 06, 2025 5:59 pm


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 40 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  


It is currently Thu Feb 06, 2025 5:59 pm
RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
8m
BORED The Band Name Game
Cokey
64543
9m
Game - Song Titles
Cokey
41541
13m
Transfer Talk V5
TheBlackPear
827
21m
2025 Southstandercom Prediction Competition Week 1
Cokey
5
30m
We need injury update
Khlav Kalash
12
34m
London or Goole in cup
REDWHITEANDB
58
42m
A look behind the scenes at Warringtons preseason
ratticusfinc
10
45m
Sheffield Challenge Cup A
Mark_P1973
22
50m
Challenge Cup - York Acorn
Steve0
38
Recent
Super League
FIL
109
Recent
Film game
BOSS HOG
7332
Recent
Catalans again
Greg Florimo
12
Recent
Another one bites the dust
Returnwr to
27
Recent
Goal kicker
Wires71
21
Recent
Wakefield Trinity Heritage Podcast - Season 4
wakeytrin
5
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
0s
Challenge Cup - York Acorn
Steve0
38
1s
We need injury update
Khlav Kalash
12
7s
ALL NEW 49ERS ERA LEEDS UTD THREAD
tad rhino
3036
12s
Recruitment rumours and links
Wires71
3905
20s
BORED The Band Name Game
Cokey
64543
20s
DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings
Hasbag
4863
23s
Goal kicker
Wires71
21
32s
A look behind the scenes at Warringtons preseason
ratticusfinc
10
34s
LukeLittler stadium
Wires71
11
41s
Game - Song Titles
Cokey
41541
43s
Pre Season - 2025
number 6
514
43s
Rumours and signings v9
[Gareth]
29218
48s
Film game
BOSS HOG
7332
48s
Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE
Jason65
3134
52s
Squads - Leopards v Workington
LeythIg
3
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
Squad for the Cup game
The Speculat
3
TODAY
Last Man Standing - Match Prediction Competition
Jemmo
1
TODAY
We need injury update
Khlav Kalash
12
TODAY
Betfred Super League Season Set For Spectacular Start
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
Smoking vapes cheaper options
someonehasmy
1
TODAY
2025 Southstandercom Prediction Competition Week 1
Cokey
5
TODAY
Eagles v Wigan Parking
hawk-eye
1
TODAY
Squads - Leopards v Workington
LeythIg
3
TODAY
Sheffield Challenge Cup A
Mark_P1973
22
TODAY
LukeLittler stadium
Wires71
11
TODAY
French
Mark_P1973
4
TODAY
Can we compare
Big lads mat
11
TODAY
Goal kicker
Wires71
21
TODAY
A look behind the scenes at Warringtons preseason
ratticusfinc
10
TODAY
Cas H
Clickin'knee
25
TODAY
Fantasy Rugby League
Ashton Bears
1
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS
Betfred Super League Season Se..
214
Thirteen Try York Knights Set ..
422
Comfortable Ash Handley Testim..
1145
Workington Town Set Up Leigh L..
925
Historic Goole Vikings Win Ove..
1031
Thatto Heath Hold On To Set Up..
1196
Army Beat The RAF In Challenge..
1179
Waterhead Warriors Golden Poin..
1261
Four From Rugby League Honoure..
1700
Leeds Rhinos Beat Wakefield Tr..
2497
Wigan Warriors crowned Team of..
2571
Ben Lam Leaves Dragons..
2340
New Roles for HULL KR...
2280
Jet2 has signed a major sponso..
2433
Thirkill and Hood complete Hul..
2592
RLFANS Match Centre
Matches on TV
Fri 7th Feb
CC2025
20:00
York-Hull KR
Sat 8th Feb
CC2025
12:00
Halifax-Catalans
Sun 9th Feb
CC2025
13:00
Bradford-Castleford
Thu 13th Feb
SL
20:00
Wigan-Leigh
Fri 14th Feb
SL
20:00
Hull KR-Castleford
SL
20:00
Catalans-Hull FC
Sat 15th Feb
SL
15:00
Leeds - Wakefield
SL
17:30
St.Helens-Salford
Sun 16th Feb
SL
15:00
Huddersfield-Warrington
Thu 20th Feb
SL
20:00
Wakefield - Hull KR
Fri 21st Feb
SL
20:00
Warrington-Catalans
SL
20:00
Hull FC-Wigan
Sat 22nd Feb
SL
15:00
Salford-Leeds
SL
20:00
Castleford-St.Helens
Sun 23rd Feb
SL
14:30
Leigh-Huddersfield
Fri 28th Feb
SL
20:00
Huddersfield-Hull FC
SL
20:00
Hull KR-Salford
SL
20:00
Leigh-Catalans
Sat 1st Mar
SL
14:30
Wakefield - St.Helens
SL
21:30
Wigan-Warrington
Sun 2nd Feb
CC2025 2 Keighley12-72York
1895 0 Midlands52-24Whitehaven
1895 0 Newcastle0-60Crusaders
Sat 1st Feb
1895 0 Rochdale64-12Cornwall
RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
8m
BORED The Band Name Game
Cokey
64543
9m
Game - Song Titles
Cokey
41541
13m
Transfer Talk V5
TheBlackPear
827
21m
2025 Southstandercom Prediction Competition Week 1
Cokey
5
30m
We need injury update
Khlav Kalash
12
34m
London or Goole in cup
REDWHITEANDB
58
42m
A look behind the scenes at Warringtons preseason
ratticusfinc
10
45m
Sheffield Challenge Cup A
Mark_P1973
22
50m
Challenge Cup - York Acorn
Steve0
38
Recent
Super League
FIL
109
Recent
Film game
BOSS HOG
7332
Recent
Catalans again
Greg Florimo
12
Recent
Another one bites the dust
Returnwr to
27
Recent
Goal kicker
Wires71
21
Recent
Wakefield Trinity Heritage Podcast - Season 4
wakeytrin
5
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
0s
Challenge Cup - York Acorn
Steve0
38
1s
We need injury update
Khlav Kalash
12
7s
ALL NEW 49ERS ERA LEEDS UTD THREAD
tad rhino
3036
12s
Recruitment rumours and links
Wires71
3905
20s
BORED The Band Name Game
Cokey
64543
20s
DoR - New Coach - Investor & Adam - New signings
Hasbag
4863
23s
Goal kicker
Wires71
21
32s
A look behind the scenes at Warringtons preseason
ratticusfinc
10
34s
LukeLittler stadium
Wires71
11
41s
Game - Song Titles
Cokey
41541
43s
Pre Season - 2025
number 6
514
43s
Rumours and signings v9
[Gareth]
29218
48s
Film game
BOSS HOG
7332
48s
Wigan v Sts discussion - THIS THREAD ONLY PLEASE
Jason65
3134
52s
Squads - Leopards v Workington
LeythIg
3
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
Squad for the Cup game
The Speculat
3
TODAY
Last Man Standing - Match Prediction Competition
Jemmo
1
TODAY
We need injury update
Khlav Kalash
12
TODAY
Betfred Super League Season Set For Spectacular Start
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
Smoking vapes cheaper options
someonehasmy
1
TODAY
2025 Southstandercom Prediction Competition Week 1
Cokey
5
TODAY
Eagles v Wigan Parking
hawk-eye
1
TODAY
Squads - Leopards v Workington
LeythIg
3
TODAY
Sheffield Challenge Cup A
Mark_P1973
22
TODAY
LukeLittler stadium
Wires71
11
TODAY
French
Mark_P1973
4
TODAY
Can we compare
Big lads mat
11
TODAY
Goal kicker
Wires71
21
TODAY
A look behind the scenes at Warringtons preseason
ratticusfinc
10
TODAY
Cas H
Clickin'knee
25
TODAY
Fantasy Rugby League
Ashton Bears
1
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS
Betfred Super League Season Se..
214
Thirteen Try York Knights Set ..
422
Comfortable Ash Handley Testim..
1145
Workington Town Set Up Leigh L..
925
Historic Goole Vikings Win Ove..
1031
Thatto Heath Hold On To Set Up..
1196
Army Beat The RAF In Challenge..
1179
Waterhead Warriors Golden Poin..
1261
Four From Rugby League Honoure..
1700
Leeds Rhinos Beat Wakefield Tr..
2497
Wigan Warriors crowned Team of..
2571
Ben Lam Leaves Dragons..
2340
New Roles for HULL KR...
2280
Jet2 has signed a major sponso..
2433
Thirkill and Hood complete Hul..
2592


Visit the RLFANS.COM SHOP
for more merchandise!












.