The facts say otherwise.







I really don't know whether you're trolling here, Standee, or whether you mean that:



1) Working in a museum isn't 'real' work – which itself suggests that museums are worthless;



2) Work experience isn't useful?

We don't know that she is workshy and we don't know what her volunteering duties involved.

But yes, it's immaterial to the issue of Poundland being the only winners, if that's what you meant.

On the basis that, after the Poundland nonsense, she apparently went and found a part-time job at Morrisons, while also doing work experience at the museum, it's a fair bet that we know that she is not "workshy".

Indeed, fair point.

I like Standee...He is an enigmatic conundrum. He can work himself into an orgasmic lather leading the righteous in a cavalry charge to have injustices over a couple of photos being displaced at the KC...Alternatively he can come on a thread like this and talk narrow-minded bollox!

What I don’t get is the Work Programme cost the tax payer about £5 billion, I think, and, (as far gaining full-time employment is concerned), being on the WP is worse than ‘doing nothing’.

The government has been accused of artificially reducing the unemployment figures by 105,000 because they are counting unemployed people on these work placement schemes as employed.



From here: [urlhttp://www.theyworkforyou.com/wrans/?id=2012-10-23d.124129.h[/url



"Those participants whose activity comprises any form of work, work experience or work-related training are classified as in employment. This is regardless of whether the individual is paid or not."



There also an issue of people being under-employed i.e. people in work who are seeking longer hours but can't get them. This is also in part thought to be linked to the free labour these work placements provide.



Finally there is the issue of falling unemployment yet no growth in GDP. More people said to be in work but the country is not producing more and income tax receipts are down. This is also partly explained by people doing voluntary work on a work placement scheme being classed as employed yet they aren't producing anything nor paying tax or NI because their income is JSA and not a wage from an employer.

Smoke and mirrors, methinks.



The whole Atos/A4e/WorkFare/demonisation of disabled, unemployed, low-paid, anyone on any benefit etc etc is nothing other than playing with deckchairs on the Titanic; the iceberg in question being the fact that there are neither enough jobs around for the working-age population, nor enough jobs that pay a living wage so that the taxpayer does not continue, via in-work benefits, to have to subsidise companies.



Successive governments have both helped to create/facilitate the development of this situation – and not done enough to tackle this central iceberg, while also not telling the public that this is at the heart of the issue.

In a shellnut.

Waste of time and money? www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politic ... thing.html Happening now. www.publications.parliament.uk/p ... 2-0003.htm www.parliament.uk/edm/2012-13/1072 Watch this space? www.legislation.gov.uk/new/2013- ... 2013-02-14

Waste of time and money? www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politic ... thing.html Happening now. www.publications.parliament.uk/p ... 2-0003.htm www.parliament.uk/edm/2012-13/1072 Watch this space? www.legislation.gov.uk/new/2013- ... 2013-02-14

Quote V6Chuk="V6Chuk"Waste of time and money? www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politic ... thing.html'" "The employment minister, Mark Hoban, suggested the double-dip recession had taken a toll on the programme." Exactly. There are not enough jobs. And no amount of paying companies to get people into jobs will work if those jobs do not exist. We also know that there have been rises in things like zero-hours contracts, which take people off any unemployment register, even if they only get a couple of hour's work a week. Companies and organisations have cut hours for some workers too. It's no wonder that we're still not seeing any rise in consumer confidence, despite the further attempts to claim that unemployment is falling and that we're on the cusp of economic growth.

Quote V6Chuk="V6Chuk"Waste of time and money? www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politic ... thing.html'" "The employment minister, Mark Hoban, suggested the double-dip recession had taken a toll on the programme." Exactly. There are not enough jobs. And no amount of paying companies to get people into jobs will work if those jobs do not exist. We also know that there have been rises in things like zero-hours contracts, which take people off any unemployment register, even if they only get a couple of hour's work a week. Companies and organisations have cut hours for some workers too. It's no wonder that we're still not seeing any rise in consumer confidence, despite the further attempts to claim that unemployment is falling and that we're on the cusp of economic growth.

David Cameron also attempted to claim that thousands of new jobs had been created, when in fact they were simply jobs that existed in the public sector (higher education) being transferred to the private sector.