If a Club does incur an Insolvency Event, then the Board of the Rugby Football League has the right to terminate that Club’s Membership of the Rugby Football League and grant Membership to another entity on such terms as it sees fit. The Board’s Insolvency Policy sets out how it will usually exercise its discretion and states that one of the conditions imposed on any new Member will, save in specified cases, be a sporting sanction of a 12-point deduction. This sends a clear message to Clubs of the unacceptability of Insolvency Events.



Exact wording from RFL website.

Creditors due over one year after the BALANCE SHEET DATE. If YW HE ISC are in there, then they are not F***ING due for lets see. 31st January 2019 plus a year....???...???...



ah, 31st January 2020. November, December, January. A [uminimum[/u of three months before due.



Yes, I agree that there is scope for cash to disappear, but £400k seems excessive given the monitoring by the RFL:



Clubs must notify the Rugby Football League of any event that has a material impact on its Budget and must demonstrate performance against budget in half year and full year returns. If a Club is not achieving its budget during a Season the Rugby Football League has the right to impose a signing embargo.



Year one AC was putting money in. Year two he was putting money in. so year three he takes £400k in cash out? whatever we both think of the RFL, the monitoring puts pressure on declaration of all receipts, to stay on budget, because costs are easy to add but income so difficult, just read this forum on who wants to be a fan. You can do the cash thing around the fringes if there is no scrutiny but no, £400k in a year is a urine extraction.



Most receipts will be direct BACS (RFL distribution, Chalmers/his backer, sponsors etc), BACS from whichever card acquirer used, cheques, and only then cash. OK I have only worked in manufacturing wholesale and just recently pure retail, never for a sports club, but I do not believe that Sports is that significantly different to the extent of £400k in cash missing in a year. Chalmers would need a 40 footer to lug that amount away.



Please, learn a bit about business, let alone accounts, and I will start taking you seriously, if there is s**t there it needs to come out, but you are camouflaging any such possibility with your blanket .



Just a thought, but is someone setting you up with all this junk?



After the first insolvency I did an analysis, of the bulls accounts of course but more importantly of the dynamics of the socio-economic environment in Bradford that affected the Bulls. I concluded they were all working against the club to produce fewer fans. Ok maybe you would hit a bit of a good patch club wise, but it would never get near the golden days. therefore without a sugar daddy we would never get anywhere near that success. My opinion remains the same, bolstered by the facts: three owners, £3.7m paid into the business by them, and here we are. What amazes me is that nobody including you has learnt anything from that history.



If you do have a consortium behind you, my recommendation is to set up a club called Bradford Rabbulls or similar, with a serious emphasis on developing local young players, and work your way up from whatever division you start in. Then when the next Bulls insolvency event occurs, you will be there in place to seize the opportunity.

btw nestegg, Yes I am an accountant, but not a bean counter by choice, rather an management accountant with an MBA in business strategy backed up by growing businesses and shrinking them through several cycles of growth and recession, and I have set up and run my own business - no not a consultancy business, but importing manufacturing and selling interactive fitness equipment targeted at getting obese children exercising. so I have theory and practice in abundance, held the reins as owner and MD and FC, and I can tell you, there are shades of grey, not black and white with nothing in the middle.

It's a shame that Dame FA is no longer treading the boards with this particular pantomime, his off the cuff asides will be missed by many.



Anyone know Billy Pearce? and can get him on this Forum?

I for one miss reading FA’s contribution’s.

When such a loyal fan like him gives up the ghost I fear the end is nigh. The club will limp on but not as we know it.

I believe gates of circa 1000 will be the norm. The club has lost its identity and cannot even attract a full time owner/custodian.

How on earth can the club retain its name, playing out of the city with an owner of another club over seeing its decline! As for Nigel Wood?

He has other interests and why wouldn’t he. That’s his income stream and his focus.

Mark Sawyer has many other businesses he runs generating his income, still runs Desbury well and has done for pushing 20 yrs so a f/t owner isn’t essential. After all I assume Chalmers was f/t over here and we can see how that went

Couldn't agree more with your comments re NW's income stream and everything else that has gone on - it's a sad indictment from an organisation and indiviiduals who couldn't care less as to what really happens to our once great Club. My wife and I have decided enough is enough after the many years we have supported the Club,

Whilst I respect everyone’s opinion, this is my own personal take on it and I don’t want people to agree, they will form their own thoughts.



My take is that I’ve supported this club for about 42 yrs of my 45 on this planet and I’ve always had a passion for Bradford. I will continue to support despite seeing many frustrating situations over the last 8yrs.



I look at it like a friend or family member in that if they’d had a couple of poor relationships, lost their jobs, had their house repossessed etc they need my support and I couldn’t just cast them adrift. If they then came back and said they had found a new partner and were looking to get back on their feet then whilst I would be nervous about the relationship you can’t assume the Next one will be like the last one.



I’ve watched them win titles, WCC, Challenge cups, I’ve seen them sell Hanley, Phil Ford, Newlove, Skerrett, Bug Les and Henry Paul and I’m sure there are others I’ve missed but we’ve survived, in a fashion, and replaced them



At the moment I’m been asked to part with £200 for a s/t which if we go bust i will get a refund and if we survive I’ll see 13 games of rugby involving Bradford



I know others have had enough but at the moment I feel like I need to try and assist where I can and try and help this once great club start climbing.



Scepticism understood and whilst it does appear a strange one for the new owners to get involved but in the absence of anything other than speculation and rumour I have to hope that they will get things right and we will start to become self sufficient



Not every one will agree and it’s personal choice, but that’s my thoughts



I’ll either pay on the gate or buy a ticket which is likely to result in a s/t purchase as I’m tight and it will be cheaper!



COYB!!!!!

Whilst I understand where you're coming from, and as you say, everyone will have their own opinion... If I was to buy into your analogy I would say some people are feeling like they've been supporting that family member financially, be it through buying them food or loaning them money, only to have that person continue to lie to them and spend the money on alcohol instead of on paying their bills. There comes a point where you have to cut them off because they're just p*ssing your money up the wall.

Bully for you Betsy, we also have seen the highs and lows over the many years of our joint support. But our feelings at this moment are the worst con in our chequered past has been perpetrated, and with only one of the perps. now involved we know self interest will push us to the brink. Personally I fervently hope you are right, and I am totally wrong! However my gut feeling is not good about it all, and this is the second time in the 7 years of the disaster unfolding. Guess which was the first? Funnily enough our overall new owner was heavily involved in that fiasco!

I have very much had the same thoughts as you have over the past 3 administrations/ownerships. However, this current one feels too murky and seedy for me to go with it for the time being.



I'm lucky to have some friends within the club including players and I just don't like what I'm hearing.



Players who wanted to stay with the club and agreed contracts for the coming year are finding themselves in search for jobs as those offers are now being withdrawn, one of whom my family has sponsored for the past two seasons. He is genuinely gutted having turned down better offers from SL and Championship clubs and has now thankfully accepted a contract from a League 1 club. Whilst I'm happy he is sorted out, he should not have been left in that position.



On leaving the club a fairly well positioned former employee told us exactly what was going to happen and then he turned out right. He also alleged that Wood and Rimmer had been involved with the club and the ownership since 2017 (very much behind the scenes). Now I cannot prove this is right or wrong, but all I know is it sounds very corrupt if true and until there is some kind of independent inquiry into the truth then I don't feel I can morally go along with it any more.



I'm going to give you my new analogy on the situation... the family member has become hooked on drugs and whilst I will always love and support them in which way I can, I'm not going to give them money so they can go buy more drugs and do themselves more harm.



I will always be a supporter of this club and will never switch my allegiances to another team. but for now I will sit it out, watch and wait to see how it all plays out before deciding what to do next season and beyond.

That's my position at the moment.



I'll never support any other club, but for the time being I'm not supporting the current setup.

I've been told this by someone formerly involved in a Super League club. Though not 2017, 2016 when the informed C&L they club would be theirs. This was corroborated in one of AC's rants when he stated Rimmer spoke to him and requested he took the club in December 16



EDIT: Sadly I am already in for a season ticket so have to suck it up as the brexiters would say...

If the contract was offered by Chalmers/Mcfarlane etc maybe the contract offered was more the club can now afford? You can't really blame the new owners for withdrawing an offer when its all about cutting costs after another overspend. Or would we rather see them stretch the budget again?

What would it take to get people back? What else does the club need to do?

The club is doing all the usual things - resigning players (Would signing a couple of new players help, rather than keeping last years?)

Preseason training has started - media being released.

Employees being interviewed - coaching staff & players

Preseason friendlies starting to be announced

Ticket offers being announced - the Blackpool bash (meh) and the free tickets for community club u12 and younger juniors - bit more significant

Is it all about transparency? An inquiry and if mismanagement is found then punishment. Is that what we are looking for?

Or do we just not want Wood to be involved? More specifically, do we want Wood to be formally exonerated by an inquiry before we accept him....

Would we be happier if it was announced all (non-director) creditors had been paid back? Is that what it would take? That would be a statement of intent. Would help calm my background fear that administration is still pending.

There are just too many questions without answers.

In my eyes this isn't a takeover in the usual sense. It's an interim measure that is impossible to be either happy or comfortable with. There is no money involved, and we all know surely after these last few years that we can't survive on no money. Sawyer and Perez themselves admit they are a temporary team. So until we know what's to follow, there's no real cause for optimism is there.

The man sold Thrum Hall and Halifax actually became worse off. Whether through poor advice, p155 poor decision making or rampant ineptitude they are groundless, penniless and a shadow of their former selves.



That's us now. And whose fingerprints are all over this? Mr N Wood.

Well kudos to you for knowing exactly what Thorne was going to do or not.



You must by saying definite 12 points in your first post

I may have seen it mentioned in the previous 100+ pages and I have forgotten but why is Sawyer involved? Everyone is getting something out of it so what's in it for him?

The £2,000 rent per game agreement will help. Tell me any Championship that can turn down £30,000 plus?

He'd be getting that 30k irrespective of whether he was involved in the running of Bradford though surely. What's in it for him to actually take the role he has done?

Well, he's in a position to ensure they get the £30K, I suppose - which given the (alleged) tardiness of paying other clubs might not be a bad thing for Dewsbury. That said, with Dewsbury officials on the gate it may well be taken at source....

The club was already liquidated when Thorne came to an agreement with the administrator, he created a new business in Jan 2017 so pretty clear,RFL also said in bidding process would be a 12 point deduction. Like I said a bit of research helps

Well you obviously didn't research yourself correctly when previously saying



its 12 points unless you pay off all creditors so unless



So now you change your tune to definite 12 points regardless. Seems you didn't do your own research until after commenting

That was agreed weeks ago Mick,when the move to Dewsbury was finalised.So Mark Sawyer/The Rams were guaranteed that money.Why take it to the next level and get involved with our mess.I certainly dont buy the "I just wanted to help" rubbish been peddled about.Thats nearly as embarrassing as Eric Perez's nonsense "I fell.in love with Bradford Bulls ".Course you did Eric.