Joined: Nov 19 2002 Posts: 13535 Location: West Yorkshire
Zoo Zoo Boom wrote:Completely agree - for a marquee signing Croft has been very poor. Yes the pack is terrible but he offers very little when he has the opportunity. He doesn't look happy perhaps a change of club would perhaps be a good move all round.
Newman - just looks totally disinterested, perhaps carrying an ego that big is wearing him out. He is offering nothing and isn't supporting the young winger outside him - embarrassing.
Martin and maybe Bentley are the only above average players in that squad. To turn this around is going to take some significant surgery from Blease and Arthur.
Croft has had a few poor games after some personal issues but he hasn’t been poor, he is part of the solution not the problem.
christopher wrote:Croft has had a few poor games after some personal issues but he hasn’t been poor, he is part of the solution not the problem.
I disagree - as a marquee signing he should be leading by example - I have seldom seen this since he joined Leeds. As I said the pack is poor but he hasn't shown much either. You can count on less than fingers on hand the high quality performances he has put in.
christopher wrote:You simply can’t compare the NRL to SL, they operate in totally different markets, The NRL is the biggest sport in town, it has money and coverage we could only dream of, so in turn they get the pick of the athletes in their country.
That’s the ‘why’.
I think you misunderstand - through the SL era we have developed numerous local star players. The standard of the homegrown talent is nowhere near where it once was. Where are the players of the quality of Sculthorpe, Harris' McGuire, Sinfield, Burgess, Farrell etc?
Given the core of every team is made up of British players the lack of quality here that is the main reason SL is the dogs dinner it is. Why are these players so poor and so unfit?
Zoo Zoo Boom wrote:Given the core of every team is made up of British players the lack of quality here that is the main reason SL is the dogs dinner it is. Why are these players so poor and so unfit?
We only had 5 British players in that starting line up yesterday, the other 8 were overseas players. You would have to say the overall standard of the overseas players we have is pretty poor. I still can’t work out how we ended up with a long haired foreign exchange student playing centre for us. Is the real Momorovski locked up in a shed in Wollongong or somewhere ? One things for sure, if I was Brad Arthur I’d be escorting him to the front door of a Turkish barber to get that stupid hair cut sorted. He spends more time f**##g about with his hair than catching a ball right in front of his face.
"Leeds is the greatest club in Rugby League" Alex Murphy 2011
It's so weird to see whenever we lose (or even win, but not as convincingly as normal) just how much of the posters on here hate our own players.
I'm all for a good discussion, and players aren't beyond criticism at all, but some of the posts are embarrassing.
Didn't manage to watch the game, but sounds like we've massively rode our luck, which we've not had much of this season. Saw BA on the behind the scenes footage say let's put this one to bed and move on. Hopeful we'll perform better against Hull and keep our push for the play-offs on track!
A painfully low quality SL game. Barely championship standard tbh. Echoes of the RS era, with mistake after mistake putting us under pressure and absolutely no idea in attack. Only the defensive line speed and intent has improved.
I'm confident we have the right coach, but too many of the players are not at the required level. Only Martin, Miller and Bentley come out with any credit. We just need rid of the likes of Fusitua, Sangare, Frawley, Goudemand, possibly even Momirovski, Newman and Ackers. It's a shame with Harry, but he is a shadow of the player that burst on to the scene. His pace has gone and he is awful in defence. So far, Ackers and Momirovski have been poor signings. O'Connor has put Ackers to shame at 9. No doubt we'll sell O'Connor to Hull. And I don't know where we go with Cam Smith. Hasn't worked out as captain and his game has suffered. He's not a prop. Maybe a change of club is the answer for him.
We know that the front row needs major surgery, but we also need an impact back row, a winger, a centre and a 7. Oh, and a goal kicker. Big changes needed this off season.
Joined: Feb 26 2002 Posts: 9510 Location: anywhere, literally...
If I were to look at who will be here next season, and where we will need to strengthen, this is what I could envisage us looking like:
Miller Hall Newman (last season of contract, must improve dramatically or not renewed) Momirovski (last season of contract, must improve dramatically or not renewed) Handley Croft Frawley (last season of contract, must improve dramatically or not renewed) New Prop Ackers New Prop Bentley New Backrow O'Connor
Oledzki Holroyd (last season of contract, must improve dramatically or not renewed) Gannon (last season of contract, must improve dramatically or not renewed) New Prop / Loose Forward / Smith (but must improve dramatically)
Outside of this, anyone over 25 can leave, and there will be more changes the following year based on how players perform. We have to get the foundations right for the younger players to come in, environment, culture, standards, results.
It's not how much talent you've got, it's what you do with it that counts.
Joined: Aug 02 2002 Posts: 7167 Location: Wakefield but near to Leeds!
The worry is most of the garbage we have are contracted until at least next season. So unless we can get some of them to other clubs who will take on their contract it is unlikely we see anything of significance and the thought that 2 new props will suddenly get us into the top 4 is a long way off. BA is not Harry Potter to coin an Eric Ten Haag quote.
Joined: May 28 2002 Posts: 7361 Location: Isca Dumnoniorum
Batley, in all seriousness, why should Gannon be treated in the same boat as the players considered failing this season? The guy is a lot younger than most of the players you mention needing to step up, and it is hardly his fault that he's been unlucky with concussions. Not in the same category as Newman at all, even if Newman is carrying an injury.
And why is Bentley suddenly in the keep list, is it because he has a longer contract? He's also struggled with concussion and missed most of the season, like Gannon. He plays a handful of decent games after being part liability and part ineffectual because he lacks size for most of his Leeds career, and now he's a first choice player for you. You don't mention McDonnell at all who has been light years ahead of Bentley for two seasons and earned an England call-up.
I could go on... Frawley has arguably improved much more than Bentley, Ackers is also very hit and miss but gets a free pass from you.
Sunday was IMO the worst game I've seen Leeds play all season, but dissecting individual performances seems pretty pointless to me - welcome to the world of knee jerkery. Leeds have perennially tended to be brought down to the level of the weaker teams in SL, even the Goldens did it with surprising regularity (esp. under McDermott).
Look at the last few games under Arthur, we know they are much better than this, and they will be again before the season is out.
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