Once were Loiners wrote:We haven't been mullered on the scoreboard, but there's something depressingly familiar about the way we're losing games this year vs last season. Losing field position - check. Bad errors when in possession - check. Mostly OK line defence followed by a howler letting in a try - check.
I cannot see GH making a move until the off season myself. If we lose both games at Hull and London maybe that will change, but for good or bad he's decided Smith is the man to take the club forward over the longer term.
Even if/when a decision is made to make a change, I can't see Leeds looking for a coach in a professional way. Furner got the gig as an ex-player. Agar was a caretaker coach who got a dead cat bounce and then proved his previous record as a coach was a pretty accurate guide to his ability. Smith seemingly got the gig because he knows Chev and is Tony's nephew. None of that smacks of a professional approach to appointing a coach. Just more jobs for the lads.
I still hope Rohan can turn things around. I really do. But if he doesn't the alternative is more likely to be some combination of Golden Generation former players with zero track record than genuinely the next 'big thing' out of Australia.
I agree with you, but we still have a problem with the quality and depth in the squad. We can speculate on the coaching, and 80% of posters on here have made their mind up fair enough, but we literally haven't had our first choice team out as far as I can remember, and that first choice team is still short of a couple of stars.
A back line of Miller, Fus, Newman, Mom and Handley is very good on paper. Problem is we've never seen them line up all together.
The pack is unable to dominate on either side of the game; but in all honesty I've never been truly satisfied with Leeds packs since I've been watching.
Last year we were decimated by injuries and defections. Actually first part of the year, before the wheels fell off, we had a couple of really good performances and results.
Ultimately the coach will carry the can for results but I want to see how we show up in these next 2 games. IF we turn around 6/10 over the next couple of weeks, overall I'd take that as start.
Gutted for McDonnell last week, he was having another really strong game in the back row but then got done several times out at centre. He needs to bend his back more at times, he goes pretty high and then gets fended with lateral movement.
tad rhino wrote:jim, anybody can play without pressure. it's easy.
the best teams/ players/ coaches deal with it
Yes and we clearly need to find a groove and some confidence and form at the moment. Hull will raise their game for us by the way, and it might not be as much of a shoe-in as some expect. They'll earmark us as we look vulnerable.
I think a fair few on here want to see us lose in order to get rid of a coach you don't like, which is fair enough.
Personally I want to see us perform better so we can go into Cats and Saints away with our tails up. Still plenty to play for this year, but we'll need something close to our first choice side to make any impact in play-offs.
I am sick of us losing so much but in all honesty we've been like this for a very long time now. This side is still better/stronger than we've had for some time, and I can see the framework of a genuinely good side starting to emerge. Time will tell.
With respect to the pack I think the first and most fundamental thing to look at is the mindset. On paper we haven't got the best front row, but attitude goes a long long way. Maybe we got scared due to suspensions a year or so ago, but without aggression you lose the contest almost every time. Its a balancing act, but I really think we'd look better with a far more aggressive attitude in the forwards. Rohan talks a lot about being in the contest, but on a micro level we lose far too many tackles, which translates to field position.
I do agree we look light in the front row. I see four genuine props in our squad. But who decided to contract a bunch of smaller second rowers and not add at least one experienced big bopper?
Once were Loiners wrote:With respect to the pack I think the first and most fundamental thing to look at is the mindset. On paper we haven't got the best front row, but attitude goes a long long way. Maybe we got scared due to suspensions a year or so ago, but without aggression you lose the contest almost every time. Its a balancing act, but I really think we'd look better with a far more aggressive attitude in the forwards. Rohan talks a lot about being in the contest, but on a micro level we lose far too many tackles, which translates to field position.
I do agree we look light in the front row. I see four genuine props in our squad. But who decided to contract a bunch of smaller second rowers and not add at least one experienced big bopper?
Yep now that I totally agree with. We were also reportedly in for Eseh and Okoro, lost both to sides above us in the table, and I'd like to know why. Eseh is from Leeds.
Holroyd has bags of potential but he does have odd brain farts, and he clearly needs an injury-free period and especially an injury-free preseason. Mik loses the collision too much and gets put in his back, his PTB is painfully slow very often. Sangare is very Route 1 and can be effective there - he is massive though. Lisone is rocks and diamonds, very aggressive but prone to brain farts also.
I still have hopes for Hudson, the lad is big but he has some toe and decent handling too actually. Probably more a player for 2025 in all seriousness though. Meantime we look like we need a real starting prop and another hard hitting / running back row; not Goudemand/Donaldson/Bentley/O'Connor type. Especially if Martin leaves we're gonna have to spend some money; I'd sign a first grade best-we-can-get back rower to replace him and then let everyone else fight it out for the other spot.
KaeruJim wrote:I think for me I want to see how Leeds are playing with a little less pressure from the opposition. Hopefully we can pick up 2 wins next and be 6/10, which actually isn't awful as a win rate even if performances are wobbly.
I think my minimum success result for us this year was top half finish and a decent showing in play-offs. If we lose one of the next two games I'm not sure we're going to finish top half and so even voodoo doll gets dusted off. We need to be dominant too because points difference could well matter at the back end of the year.
Jim, top 4 finish and a decent cup and playoff run should have been the minimum target this year given the money spent on recruitment. anything less than that is a failure. GH said himself the recruitment undertaken should make us competitive at the top of the comp and this is where we should expect to be given the club's size and power.
chapylad wrote:Lee Briers wants a head coach job either here or in the NRL.
Couldn't stand Briers as a player - is he another genius coach like Sean Long I wonder...?
Here's a leftfield name for you all: Andrew Henderson at York. I think he's doing a really good job over there - team performance against Bradford at the weekend was everything Leeds haven't been great at if I'm honest. Really solid and committed team performance with good shape at times.
Trebor1 wrote:Jim, top 4 finish and a decent cup and playoff run should have been the minimum target this year given the money spent on recruitment. anything less than that is a failure. GH said himself the recruitment undertaken should make us competitive at the top of the comp and this is where we should expect to be given the club's size and power.
Yep well personally I'm prepared to wait another season for a genuine top 4 push. I think our native lads will improve further, and obviously we still need to tinker with some additional signings to bolster that.
Top half and something in the play-offs would mean progress for me; although of course we're looking disappointing in light of the players we've brought in.
I agree a club of our size should be way stronger than we are, but this has been us under several different coaches for a very long time now. Something's not clicking.
Joined: Aug 02 2002 Posts: 7168 Location: Wakefield but near to Leeds!
KaeruJim wrote:Couldn't stand Briers as a player - is he another genius coach like Sean Long I wonder...?
Here's a leftfield name for you all: Andrew Henderson at York. I think he's doing a really good job over there - team performance against Bradford at the weekend was everything Leeds haven't been great at if I'm honest. Really solid and committed team performance with good shape at times.
Briers seems to be going well in the NRL and is well thought of. Sometimes a second in command gets away with it more for sure. Henderson again is another who might benefit an assistant role to a SL coach. Didn`t he have that role before?
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