Joined: Apr 03 2002 Posts: 4958 Location: North West
northernbloke wrote:Travelling to Toronto totally different, .
Championship Clubs travelled to Toronto, most arrived at least 48 to 72 hours before match day! even if the departed for home the following day, by the time they arrive home, and sleep, it's another 48 hours, not many part time players would want to miss out on the experience visiting Canada.
The RFL in my opinion, once Covid restrictions commenced, should have made one ruling for all Championship Clubs travelling to Toulouse.
northernbloke wrote:I don't think toulouse are playing the system at all.
Really? Why did they play 2 home games in the UK earlier in the season then? Is Toulouse twinned with widnes? Are there cultural ties? The french want up.....so they figured out that worst case scenario they'd need at least 2 home games played to qualify with the minimum number of games......note they didn't play London or Fev, their 2 supposed rivals, but instead Swinton and widnes....bottom half sides. If they're invited to SL next year I expect the SL chairmen won't be as accommodating...
[quote="northernbloke"] Travelling to Toronto totally different, one or two days off work, currently travelling to France, 10 days quarantine required if not double jabbed.
You are once again missing the point. Championship players who have chosen not to vaccinate when they could have made themselves unavailable for selection for a game in France. It is not a question of 7 covid or close contact issues, but non availability of a player just as if they were injured or employer wouldn'tgive them time off. The club still needs to fulfill the fixture & if they cannot, we know the penalty is a 24-0 defeat, fine & deduction of 2 points.
Of course that doesn't apply to SL clubs as we have seen this week where failing to fulfill a fixture & breaching covid protocols only attracts a fine.
You still seem to be avoiding the Batley conundrum NB why is that?
Deadcowboys1 wrote:Championship players who have chosen not to vaccinate when they could have made themselves unavailable for selection for a game in France.
Interesting stat from the USA regarding Covid in August 2021.....they claim that they have more hospitalised cases than last year at this time with some 100,000 people currently in beds and 96.8% of those are UNVACCINATED. Never mind the RFL and Toulouse....if you choose not to have the vax you need your bumps felt
What is the batley conundrum? Are all the batley players and staff vaccinated? If they are not, then the law as it currently stands means those part time players and staff would have to isolate on return, and not be able to work. Nothing on that front has changed currently. Clubs cannot legally enforce players to vaccinate. A part time sportsman may or may not have been offered an NHS jab, part time I would suspect have no leverage to get jabbed early.
The SL clubs that have been fined for breaching covid protocols have been punished for exactly that, if those breaches then led to positive tests then agree they should be docked points. As for toulouse playing home games in the UK who is going to pay for that, I would suggest like catalan every game they play in the UK costs them circa 50k. Not sustainable to expect them to do that hone and away, unless the aim is to put them out of business
Championship Clubs travelled to Toronto, most arrived at least 48 to 72 hours before match day! even if the departed for home the following day, by the time they arrive home, and sleep, it's another 48 hours, not many part time players would want to miss out on the experience visiting Canada.
Discussion thats been had before, most clubs and match officials flew late thu or fri and were home mon morn. Thats at worse 3 days lost work. Feel free to talk about jet leg but perfectly feasible on toronto long weekend to stay on UK time with game KO time so jet lag minimal. Match officials did actually did 3 day option fri out Sunday back so part time match officials lost 2 days. Toulouse could be done in a day so depending day 5 test to release technically unvax players could be freed on the following fri, its still 4 days where they could lose money from main job. London being docked points! The club chose to fight the decision to insist we travel at wrong time, reality 24-0 a good result and it saved 50k. My personal opinion is we should not have been forced to commit to the game. I do understand the thinking behind it tho. But not a lot I can do as a fan to change that so, you accept it. If its found cas and Saints breaches led to, covid transmission and cx games, personally I think yes they should be docked points, but how do you prove that
northernbloke wrote:Clubs cannot legally enforce players to vaccinate.
I beg to differ.
If I perceived that an unvaccinated member of my staff is putting their colleagues and our customers at risk, they wouldn't be a member of my staff for long. I'd be more than happy to defend my stance in a court of law. The stance wouldn't be a case of dismissal because on non vaccination, but on Health and Safety Grounds......but even then, you'd maybe not have to fire them if they're on a pay for play contract.....just don't pick them!
Simply put. Part time players use RL as a secondary source of income......if they don't get jabbed, they don't get picked as they are a health risk to their colleagues and other business related contacts and they don't get paid! I'd counter that Insurance companies will be loathe to offer cover to anyone who declines the vaccine.....Insurers don't have an obligation to offer cover as we found out here after earthquakes....so a part time player who doesn't want the vax can be sidelined without pay quite legally.
northernbloke wrote:What is the batley conundrum? Are all the batley players and staff vaccinated? If they are not, then the law as it currently stands means those part time players and staff would have to isolate on return, and not be able to work. Nothing on that front has changed currently. Clubs cannot legally enforce players to vaccinate. A part time sportsman may or may not have been offered an NHS jab, part time I would suspect have no leverage to get jabbed early.
The SL clubs that have been fined for breaching covid protocols have been punished for exactly that, if those breaches then led to positive tests then agree they should be docked points. As for toulouse playing home games in the UK who is going to pay for that, I would suggest like catalan every game they play in the UK costs them circa 50k. Not sustainable to expect them to do that hone and away, unless the aim is to put them out of business
Let me try an explain this 1 more time NB. The NHS opened booking jabs for 25 year olds from 8/6/21, 21 year olds from 16/6/21 & 18 year olds from 18/6/21. Assuming players took up that offer straight away, which as OM says should be expected on health grounds, add 8 weeks for 2nd jab + 2 week post period the French require & you can see that Halifax would not have had time to vaccinate their players in time for their game. Batley could have & York should have. Nothing to do with early jabs.
This is not about covid but player availability. Not being double jabbed is no different from having an injury or work commitments preventing you playing. You don't travel to France.
The Batley conundrum is the RFL blindly announced back in July that their game like Halifax's was off. We know Halifax's game had to be cancelled but Batley's could have gone ahead unless a covid/close contact issue arose. If they are unable to raise a team, then they should forfeit the match not have it just waived away as cancelled as has happened.
For the record, the RFL statement said Cas & Huddersfield had failed to fulfill fixtures & broken covid protocols but only fined. Broncos failed to fulfill a fixture & were find, deducted 2 points & had the game awarded to the opposition team. Fev broke covid protocols & were fined & had 2 points deducted. It is all in the integrity of the competition apparently.
You're good with figures OM, how many SL games have been called off due to covid & how many have been rearranged? Also how many Championship games have been called off due to covid & rearranged? If you are really short of something to do, given that the RFL have likened their covid protocols to be on a par with the Premier League, how many of their games were cancelled?
You're good with figures OM, how many SL games have been called off due to covid & how many have been rearranged? Also how many Championship games have been called off due to covid & rearranged? If you are really short of something to do, given that the RFL have likened their covid protocols to be on a par with the Premier League, how many of their games were cancelled?
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