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 Post subject: Re: Who did Amber in?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2018 9:51 pm 
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Cronus.

You speak with great conviction & your arguments are compelling, but if you're correct, why then has she jumped?

Have the Opposition forced her hand - nah, they couldn't even manage to force a smile out of her.

Perhaps the Press, they certainly still have a large influence on the fools that read 'em.

The media? It's still a little niche for the majority.

If her failings didn't warrant her resignation, why go?






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 Post subject: Re: Who did Amber in?
PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2018 10:03 pm 
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Cronus wrote:Exactly - why wouldn't she prepare and answer accordingly? We know she's an excellent speaker and can think on her feet - I assume we've all seen her in action in debates. So why trip up now? The answer is pretty obvious. She didn't know.

Either way, targets shouldn't be a toxic subject. Even that bumbling mess Diane Abbott agreed this morning that targets need to be in place. How can any department function without utilising data and having goals?

No, targets are only toxic if your agenda tells you it is. Targets or some similar KPI are right and proper and should be set according to the numbers being dealt with. The issue here is the overzealous manner in which the rules have been applied due to the strength of feeling surrounding immigration. Common sense has failed in the case of the Windrush generation - but until it became clear an entire wave of migrants had fallen foul of an administrative cock-up which left them exposed to migration rules, you had individuals working on individual cases. Sometimes the wider picture takes longer to materialise.

As I said, it's being sorted. I've now seen several of the Windrush generation being egged on by TV journalists, telling us how they don't feel welcome and how racist the UK is, yet whose cases have already been resolved quickly and efficiently, and have been granted indefinite leave to remain at a single interview taking less than 2 hours.

And I don't agree she would necessarily have known about targets set in every part of the Home Office. Is the CEO of any business employing some 30,000 people personally informed of every target set in every office of every division? Of course not. Immigration is only one division of the enormous behemoth that is the Home Office, and only some parts of that division had set targets.

Yes, she should have been better prepared and better briefed. So should Glyn Williams, who was sitting next to her and also didn't know the answer. But like I said, it should also have been a simple matter to correct her statement and get on with the job.


i feel that your comment on targets is a rather unfair comparison.
In terms of controlling immigration, very much the topic pre the Brexit referendum and quite possibly the reason for it, the strategy for reducing or, capping numbers will have been driven by central government and in the way that a CEO may demand his managers to drive cost reductions of 10%, it's is highly likely that there would have been substantial pressure from central government and i those circumstances, it's unbelievable to say there were "no targets" or, to deny all knowledge of them .
Maybe in her memoirs, we will find out the reason that she had no knowledge or, twisted the truth.
However, Rudd was drowning under the increasing pressure regarding Windrush, which is the reason that she finally had to go

I think had the numbers been smaller and people's lives affected to a lesser extent, there wouldn't have been a problem in the first place, as the issue wouldn't have made the national press.
She will have realised that the situation was getting difficult when the Tory press started to be less sympathetic.

Personally, I think that she was being a little Clintonesque, when she denied that targets existed, perhaps hoping that the issue would disperse.

However, when "we" start deporting people or, denying them access to services or, the right to continue working , in a country that they were invited to live in, the ante increases somewhat.
Amber Rudd has been unlucky and no doubt, after the dust has settled, she will be given another opportunity for a different ministerial role, assuming thet the Tory's are still holding the reigns.

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 Post subject: Re: Who did Amber in?
PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2018 2:00 pm 
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The Tory apologists can make all the compelling and articulate arguments they want - but ask yourself this - did they show the same understanding, forgiveness and laissez-faire attitude when, for example, Diane Abbot got a number wrong in an interview last year...?

It's bullshit - however strongly and confidently argued; which was, incidentally, a large part of Amber Rudd's approach to political debate.

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 Post subject: Re: Who did Amber in?
PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2018 12:21 pm 
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She's just as inept as the rest of the Tory party. Mays reign will go down in the history books as the most shambolic in history

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 Post subject: Re: Who did Amber in?
PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2018 1:49 pm 
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Quote:She's just as inept as the rest of the Tory party. Mays reign will go down in the history books as the most shambolic in history

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Will it? It's probably one of the most challenging periods in our history but hey let's over look that shall we?

Her predecessor knew what was coming and scarpered of to oxfordshire for a pint in the local with his wealthy wife.






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 Post subject: Re: Who did Amber in?
PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2018 2:45 pm 
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Her election campaign last year was one of the worst ever. An utter shambles. Can't blame that on the predecessor.






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 Post subject: Re: Who did Amber in?
PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2018 11:13 am 
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Seems Corbyn's rise to the heights has hit its ceiling - Labour should have wiped the floor with the Tories given the issues with the NHS, Windrush etc despite all the momentum interference they have been unable to make any real ground in the local elections.






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 Post subject: Re: Who did Amber in?
PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2018 12:02 pm 
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The spin from the Tory owned press this morning has been nothing short of superb! Even the american associated press has picked up on how embarassing it has been

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 Post subject: Re: Who did Amber in?
PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2018 2:02 pm 
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Exiled down south wrote:Will it? It's probably one of the most challenging periods in our history but hey let's over look that shall we?

Her predecessor knew what was coming and scarpered of to oxfordshire for a pint in the local with his wealthy wife.


Her predecessor made a severe error of judgement in allowing the EU referendum and then didn't have the sense to let someone else run the campaign.
As for challenging, yes, of course you are right.
However, May's weakness, together with her divided party, particularly on Brexit, is much of her own doing and let's not forget, it was Mays own error of judgement that made the Tory majority disappear and now they are being propped up by the DUP.

I have no sympathy with Mrs "strong and stable" May.

Just like Cameron, she gambled and lost and made the task almost impossible and with Brexit getting closer, it wont be getting easier anytime soon.

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 Post subject: Re: Who did Amber in?
PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2018 3:20 pm 
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wrencat1873 wrote:Well put Bren. :CLAP: :CLAP: :CLAP: :CLAP:
She (Rudd) did her very best to take the bullets that should have hit Mrs May and I'm sure that there will be a reward for her further down the track. However, the very policies that were in place were put there by Mrs May.
The messenger has certainly been "shot", perhaps now, Mrs May will have some explaining to do.

Perhaps all of those who have come out and sais "she never knew" or "she's done nothing wrong", should also resign, although, with just about every Tory MP having jumped to her defence, there would need to be a general election.

I don't think it's the policies as much as the organisational culture. The emphasis on making life difficult for those seen as having no right to be here. Effectively, if you had a brown skin and couldn't show documentary proof then you were fair game.
There was a woman on the news last night who'd just returned after been stuck in Jamaica for 7 years despite having a son and a daughter both born here. She didn't have the proof. She had the son and daughter but apparently they didn't count.

My wife's gone to the West Indies.
Jamaica?
No Amber Rudd did.

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