Post subject: Re: Coaching role for James Webster?
Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 9:44 am
Chris71
Moderator
Joined: Jan 30 2004 Posts: 8319 Location: Never never land away with the fairies
*1865* wrote:Reviewing video is what Horne's doing, what makes you think I'm suggesting putting that on a player?
Like I've said before, pointless discussing it now, it's as good as done.
But Horne is the Academy Coach and should be spending his time with the Academy which is another reason why the club and maybe looked at JW to allow Horne to concentrate on his role in the Academy set up
I really enjoy long walks especially when they are taken by people I don't like!
Post subject: Re: Coaching role for James Webster?
Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 9:57 am
Uppo58
International Star
Joined: May 16 2011 Posts: 594
Lang Park wrote:My view is that given that the team has recently shown form that people have been crying out for why would you want to go adding a new coach into the mix. I think it has the potential to muddy the waters and undo a lot of the good work that has been done.
Good to see you 2 have sorted the little blip out. Always good opinions from you 2.
Post subject: Re: Coaching role for James Webster?
Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 10:27 am
barham red
Player Coach
Joined: Jul 12 2007 Posts: 5410
*1865* wrote:2008/09 we had horrific injuries (Webster was Agar's assistant in 2009) in 2010 we signed Long, Fitz, O'Meley and Turner. Reckon these (the first 3 certainly) had a massive impact on our improvement.
Why is it if a team are rubbish its the coach if they do well its the players? Not sure of Websters record as a coach but I know he was unbeaten with us and went on a longish unbeaten run with Wakey when taking over, started the season well and then the inevitable collapse came due to small squad, lack of resources and injuries to key players. Pretty harsh to judge anyone on those terms. His big failing was his approach to the media and the interview where he seemed to throw the towel in.
Post subject: Re: Coaching role for James Webster?
Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 11:45 am
carl_spackler
Player Coach
Joined: Feb 20 2007 Posts: 10540 Location: Hunting Gopher
*1865* wrote:Not sure why anybody needs coaching it. If I'm running a play as a half back I want the players where I want them, not some structure somebody else has put in to place. Isn't organising part of the HB's job description?
That approach sounds pretty much exactly how we'd get several years of huge gulfs between performances with halfback consistency/availability problems.
There's a difference between getting a team well drilled and ready for your halfbacks to take control of, and essentially expecting the halfbacks to do the coaching for you. For an analogy, I'd think of the team as a car. The halfback is the driver, not the mechanic. They have input and take control, but it's not up to them to build and constantly maintain it.
Post subject: Re: Coaching role for James Webster?
Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 11:52 am
carl_spackler
Player Coach
Joined: Feb 20 2007 Posts: 10540 Location: Hunting Gopher
*1865* wrote:No I didn't.
No I haven't.
Again, you just haven't understood what I said.
Go back to page 8 and read, this time read it in the context of the post I was replying to.
I've just read it again in context and still think it's cobblers. In a well-coached side, all the halfback should need to do a lot of the time is tell the players which play he is running, and then they would all know where they need to be and what they should be doing from strong preparation (done by the coaches, not the halfbacks, in training). Maybe you worded it badly, but your post really reads as if for each play the halfback needs to hold a quick conflab on the pitch to let all the players know their places.
Post subject: Re: Coaching role for James Webster?
Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 12:04 pm
carl_spackler
Player Coach
Joined: Feb 20 2007 Posts: 10540 Location: Hunting Gopher
*1865* wrote:Are you trying to tell me we need a coach to tell players where to stand?
As opposed to needing the halfback to do the same?
*1865* wrote:The way you're making it out is far too rigid, as though every play is pre-determined.
No it isn't. It's simply knowing starting positions and how the play is expected/likely to unfold and how to react. It doesn't have to be a strict itinerary.
*1865* wrote:Organisation on the field is the HB's job.
Yes, from a set of known and practiced set of plays with improvisation thrown in. Your argument sounds more like the halfbacks having to teach the players attacking plays on the fly.
Post subject: Re: Coaching role for James Webster?
Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 12:07 pm
carl_spackler
Player Coach
Joined: Feb 20 2007 Posts: 10540 Location: Hunting Gopher
knockersbumpMKII wrote:Employing him for the sake of it implies we are doing him a favour, how can you know what he offers if you didn't interview him, speak to him to find out what he has to offer? Whilst individually we might disagree with what the owner, the coach or indeed players do and we evaluate their performances from a fans perspective it's virtually impossible to truly grasp what an individual has to offer until you speak to them in depth, find out what they are about, what they think they can offer and how they fit in with the existing team. Your evaluation of what he's done here, at Wakey etc is far too simplistic and your way of thinking just narrows down opportunities by its very nature, that the head coach is looking at different avenues to improve the end result and as an aside possibly taking some pressure/responsibility off his shoulders has to be a good thing.
I'm all for voicing a strong opinion, you know that, I'll back myself despite what people have to say but sometimes we have to wait to see what happens and then judge/re-assess things even if our intial thoughts are 'what a load of old twaddle'.
You might be completely right but I think it would be hard to prove if things go wrong given the previous 18 months or so and Radford's track record.
Nailed it, IMO. With the very limited public evidence of what Webster will/can offer us, there's not a lot we fans can accurately say on this one. Fingers crossed the club make a good judgment on their better information.
Post subject: Re: Coaching role for James Webster?
Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 12:16 pm
carl_spackler
Player Coach
Joined: Feb 20 2007 Posts: 10540 Location: Hunting Gopher
fun time frankie wrote:Wenger Ferguson morinho the 3 most successful coaches of the last 25 years not one played football at a high standard the way your saying it ronaldo couldn't be taught anything by Ferguson because he wasn't as good as a player which is rubbish because coaching and playing are completely different but you carry on with your ridiculous argument
I remember once reading/hearing a theory that when people really excel at something, they often struggle to teach others because they can't get their head around why others find difficulty in doing things that come very easy to them. It can also make them less patient and communicate less clearly, because they know what they mean but it's so natural to them that they don't know how to explain it properly.
Post subject: Re: Coaching role for James Webster?
Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 12:38 pm
Hessle Roader
Player Coach
Joined: Oct 07 2006 Posts: 4931 Location: Drypool Bridge - watching out for invaders from the East.
carl_spackler wrote:I remember once reading/hearing a theory that when people really excel at something, they often struggle to teach others because they can't get their head around why others find difficulty in doing things that come very easy to them. It can also make them less patient and communicate less clearly, because they know what they mean but it's so natural to them that they don't know how to explain it properly.
I think Bobby Charlton was a good example of this. A world class player but really struggled as a manager.
Post subject: Re: Coaching role for James Webster?
Posted: Thu Jun 04, 2015 2:12 pm
Chris28
In The Arms of 13 Angels
Joined: Oct 19 2003 Posts: 17898 Location: Packed like sardines, in a tin
Hessle Roader wrote:I think Bobby Charlton was a good example of this. A world class player but really struggled as a manager.
Look at the great Leeds United side of the 70s. Quite a few had a go at management but only Jack Charlton had any measure of success (Bremner, Clarke, Gray, Yorath, Hunter, Cooper, for example, all failed to set the world alight). Being a great player doesn't equate to becoming a great manager
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