FORUMS FORUMS






RLFANS.COM
Celebrating
25 years service to
the Rugby League
Community!

  

Home The Sin Bin Employment Query...



Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 11 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Employment Query...
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 5:17 pm 
Club Coach
International Star
User avatar

Joined: Jan 30 2005
Posts: 7152
Location: one day closer to death
Quick question: a 'friend' is having a nightmare at work and it's definitely time to move on after 8 years.

As a quick background, he is being stitched up. A manager authorised something minor, but something that by the very strictest letter probably shouldn't really have been permitted. My friend didn't ask for it or submit it - the manager did all that following a discussion between the two.

Now his line manager has got hold of it and is like a dog with a bone, citing misconduct, fraud, etc. He was called into a disciplinary and grilled for hours, despite the only actual evidence being in his favour - that being an email and letter from the other manager authorising the mildly naughty incident. He took an independent witness in who felt there was generally no case to answer. He's not seen eye to eye with his boss for a few years but stuck it out for the sake of stability.

The disciplinary is still hanging over him over a week later and he's just been told it'll be at least another week. His workload is increasing and his line manager is bombarding him with crap in a less than friendly tone. He's finding things very hard and isn't sleeping. With a new baby in the house he has enough to deal with and wants a stable job.

Leaving the fine details aside, the short & curly is that he wants to leave and is applying for jobs elsewhere. He could sign off with stress or hand in his notice (1 month without a job to go to yet), or tell them he is looking for another job. Not a union member and not interested in tribunals, etc - just wants to go asap.

So - the question is, what would be the best course of action? Sign off, resign, or simply advise his manager and HR that he accepts it is time to move on and is actively looking elsewhere, and expects to be leaving within a couple of months? Could that affect the outcome of the pending disciplinary?

Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Employment Query...
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 7:48 pm 
All Time Great
All Time Great
User avatar

Joined: May 10 2002
Posts: 47951
Location: Die Metropole
Consider constructive dismissal – but most of all, get some serious legal advice on the issue, and make sure he has every bit of evidence safe that he can get.






"You are working for Satan." Kirkstaller

"Dare to know!" Immanuel Kant

"Do not take life too seriously. You will never get out of it alive" Elbert Hubbard

"We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars." Oscar Wilde

The Voluptuous Manifesto – thoughts on all sorts of stuff.

Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Employment Query...
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 9:23 pm 
International Chairman
Player Coach
User avatar

Joined: Dec 22 2001
Posts: 14845
Is not possible to go over the heads of the two managers and present the evidence that the manager is apparently responsible and point out the apparent unfair treatment?

Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Employment Query...
PostPosted: Tue Jun 11, 2013 9:46 pm 
International Board Member
First Team Player
User avatar

Joined: Nov 01 2002
Posts: 1630
Hopefully he's in a trade union...if so he can get some free expert advice. If he's not then maybe he should consider joining one.
Best of luck to him.

Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Employment Query...
PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 9:44 am 
All Time Great
All Time Great
User avatar

Joined: May 10 2002
Posts: 47951
Location: Die Metropole
the exile wrote:Hopefully he's in a trade union...if so he can get some free expert advice. If he's not then maybe he should consider joining one...


Absolutely.

Get in one and they should be able to help. They'll have lawyers who really know their stuff on employment law etc.






"You are working for Satan." Kirkstaller

"Dare to know!" Immanuel Kant

"Do not take life too seriously. You will never get out of it alive" Elbert Hubbard

"We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars." Oscar Wilde

The Voluptuous Manifesto – thoughts on all sorts of stuff.

Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Employment Query...
PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 11:26 am 
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Sep 18 2002
Posts: 100990
Location: Doncaster
the exile wrote:Hopefully he's in a trade union...if so he can get some free expert advice.


Unfortunately not, the OP states that the the person concerned isn't a union member.

Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Employment Query...
PostPosted: Wed Jun 12, 2013 11:29 am 
Moderator
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Sep 18 2002
Posts: 100990
Location: Doncaster
Mintball wrote:Consider constructive dismissal – but most of all, get some serious legal advice on the issue, and make sure he has every bit of evidence safe that he can get.


I for one would agree with the above ... Constructive Dismissal (based on what we've been told) could well be the way to go ... as you add though, legal advice on the issue would be a must and gather / secure all available evidence.

Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Employment Query...
PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2013 1:07 pm 
Club Owner
Club Captain

Joined: Feb 29 2004
Posts: 4195
Wanderer wrote:I for one would agree with the above ... Constructive Dismissal (based on what we've been told) could well be the way to go ... as you add though, legal advice on the issue would be a must and gather / secure all available evidence.


Although 'your friend' does not want to go to the Employment Tribunal, the 'U' word is being banded about on this thread, along with 'Constructive Dismissal'.

It would be a brave lawyer to advise a client to resign and claim Constructive Dismissal. 95% of Constructive Dismissal claims fail. (And, in order to have a chance of claiming it, you have to resign pretty much immediately after the offending act/acts.)

From my experience union legal advice is, generally, not good. The member is typically referred to their union rep who will not be a solicitor or barrister. (S)he will offer some basic advice, which will be hit or miss depending on how good the union rep is and how much they know about employment law. Some of these people know next to nothing and are embarrassingly bad. Likewise, some are good and will fight your corner as if it is their own.

The case may get referred to the union's solicitor, who will look at it and probably ditch it unless they feel that there is a significantly greater than 50% chance of winning in the employment tribunal.

If you think there is a genuine prospect of an employment tribunal claim, go and see a specialist employment law solicitor and use them as a sounding board. You could even 'advice shop' (go and see several solicitors and then instruct the one you feel happiest with).

Do not pay any money for an initial consultation. Most will investigate the merit of your claim free of charge, because they will want you as a client if it is a good one.

If they think it is good they should offer to take it on a contingency fee basis - i.e. they take a percentage of whatever you win. This should be no more than 35%+VAT.

The legal market is incredibly competitive - and they will fight to attract clients with good claims. Don't feel pressured to instructing the first solicitor you speak with.

Also, be wary of anyone holding themselves out as employment law consultants offering to represent you in the employment tribunal. Most of these people are not qualified and practising solicitors or barristers for a reason - they are shockingly bad.

Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Employment Query...
PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2013 2:23 pm 
All Time Great
All Time Great
User avatar

Joined: May 10 2002
Posts: 47951
Location: Die Metropole
If your friend wants a link, then Thompsons are very good.

They are employment law specialists and do a great deal for trade union members, winning some substantial payouts.
If your friend wants a link, then Thompsons are very good.

They are employment law specialists and do a great deal for trade union members, winning some substantial payouts.






"You are working for Satan." Kirkstaller

"Dare to know!" Immanuel Kant

"Do not take life too seriously. You will never get out of it alive" Elbert Hubbard

"We are all in the gutter, but some of us are looking at the stars." Oscar Wilde

The Voluptuous Manifesto – thoughts on all sorts of stuff.

Top
   
 
 Post subject: Re: Employment Query...
PostPosted: Thu Jun 13, 2013 4:10 pm 
International Chairman
Player Coach
User avatar

Joined: Dec 22 2001
Posts: 14845
Mintball wrote:If your friend wants a link, then Thompsons are very good.

They are employment law specialists and do a great deal for trade union members, winning some substantial payouts.


They do not seem to headline the required service on that link.

Video Ref seems to have hit the nal on the head if a legal route is needed.

If its just an **** of a low-grade manager I still think going over their head (in an non-aggressive way) with the facts could work. May be worth a try before going legalistic? Once the legal route is entered into the friend will be finished in the job anyhow and would find it difficult to get other jobs if word got around.
Mintball wrote:If your friend wants a link, then Thompsons are very good.

They are employment law specialists and do a great deal for trade union members, winning some substantial payouts.


They do not seem to headline the required service on that link.

Video Ref seems to have hit the nal on the head if a legal route is needed.

If its just an **** of a low-grade manager I still think going over their head (in an non-aggressive way) with the facts could work. May be worth a try before going legalistic? Once the legal route is entered into the friend will be finished in the job anyhow and would find it difficult to get other jobs if word got around.


Last edited by Dally on Thu Jun 13, 2013 4:35 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Top
   
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 11 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next





It is currently Fri Nov 29, 2024 1:31 pm


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 97 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  


It is currently Fri Nov 29, 2024 1:31 pm
RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
3m
Mike Cooper podcast
Wires71
10
5m
2025 Shirt
Akinwale Aro
26
23m
BORED The Band Name Game
Boss Hog
63297
23m
Shirt reveal coming soon
vastman
48
29m
Game - Song Titles
Boss Hog
40832
30m
Film game
Boss Hog
5838
30m
Ground Improvements
Khlav Kalash
229
45m
ALL NEW 49ERS ERA LEEDS UTD THREAD
chapylad
2627
53m
Co-Captains for 2025
MjM
15
Recent
Transfer Talk V5
christopher
544
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
2m
Salford
ratticusfinc
63
2m
ALL NEW 49ERS ERA LEEDS UTD THREAD
chapylad
2627
3m
Film game
Boss Hog
5838
3m
Squad numbers
Warrior Wing
8
5m
Pre Season - 2025
Hasbag
202
5m
Rumours thread
Khlav Kalash
2516
6m
Game - Song Titles
Boss Hog
40832
7m
Getting a new side to gel
Highlander
8
9m
2025 Kit
bowlinboy
13
9m
2025 Recruitment
bowlinboy
228
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
England Women Las Vegas train-on squad
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
Quiz night
H.G.S.A
1
TODAY
Co-Captains for 2025
MjM
15
TODAY
Cornwall has a new owner
CM Punk
2
TODAY
Callum Shaw
Wanderer
1
TODAY
Squad Numbers
phe13
4
TODAY
Rhinos squad numbers
Rixy
1
TODAY
Squad numbers
Warrior Wing
8
TODAY
Mat Crowther pre season update
Dunkirk Spir
1
TODAY
Mike Cooper podcast
Wires71
10
TODAY
Shirt reveal coming soon
vastman
48
TODAY
Opening Championship and League One Fixtures for 2025 Released
RLFANS News
1
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS
RLFANS Match Centre
Matches on TV
Thu 13th Feb
SL
20:00
Wigan-Leigh
Fri 14th Feb
SL
20:00
Hull KR-Castleford
SL
20:00
Catalans-Hull FC
Sat 15th Feb
SL
15:00
Leeds - Wakefield
SL
17:30
St.Helens-Salford
Sun 16th Feb
SL
15:00
Huddersfield-Warrington
Thu 20th Feb
SL
20:00
Wakefield - Hull KR
Fri 21st Feb
SL
20:00
Warrington-Catalans
SL
20:00
Hull FC-Wigan
Sat 22nd Feb
SL
15:00
Salford-Leeds
SL
20:00
Castleford-St.Helens
Sun 23rd Feb
SL
14:30
Leigh-Huddersfield
Fri 28th Feb
SL
20:00
Huddersfield-Hull FC
SL
20:00
Hull KR-Salford
SL
20:00
Leigh-Catalans
Sat 1st Mar
SL
14:30
Wakefield - St.Helens
SL
21:30
Wigan-Warrington
Sun 2nd Mar
SL
15:00
Leeds-Castleford
Thu 6th Mar
SL
20:00
Hull FC-Leigh
Fri 7th Mar
SL
20:00
Castleford-Salford
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Mens Betfred Super League XXVIII ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Wigan 29 768 338 430 48
Hull KR 29 731 344 387 44
Warrington 29 769 351 418 42
Leigh 29 580 442 138 33
Salford 28 556 561 -5 32
St.Helens 28 618 411 207 30
 
Catalans 27 475 427 48 30
Leeds 27 530 488 42 28
Huddersfield 27 468 658 -190 20
Castleford 27 425 735 -310 15
Hull FC 27 328 894 -566 6
LondonB 27 317 916 -599 6
This is an inplay table and live positions can change.
Betfred Championship 2024 ROUND : 1
 PLDFADIFFPTS
Wakefield 27 1032 275 757 52
Toulouse 26 765 388 377 37
Bradford 28 723 420 303 36
York 29 695 501 194 32
Widnes 27 561 502 59 29
Featherstone 27 634 525 109 28
 
Sheffield 26 626 526 100 28
Doncaster 26 498 619 -121 25
Halifax 26 509 650 -141 22
Batley 26 422 591 -169 22
Swinton 28 484 676 -192 20
Barrow 25 442 720 -278 19
Whitehaven 25 437 826 -389 18
Dewsbury 27 348 879 -531 4
Hunslet 1 6 10 -4 0
RLFANS Recent Posts
FORUM
LAST
POST
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
3m
Mike Cooper podcast
Wires71
10
5m
2025 Shirt
Akinwale Aro
26
23m
BORED The Band Name Game
Boss Hog
63297
23m
Shirt reveal coming soon
vastman
48
29m
Game - Song Titles
Boss Hog
40832
30m
Film game
Boss Hog
5838
30m
Ground Improvements
Khlav Kalash
229
45m
ALL NEW 49ERS ERA LEEDS UTD THREAD
chapylad
2627
53m
Co-Captains for 2025
MjM
15
Recent
Transfer Talk V5
christopher
544
FORUM
LAST
VIEW
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
2m
Salford
ratticusfinc
63
2m
ALL NEW 49ERS ERA LEEDS UTD THREAD
chapylad
2627
3m
Film game
Boss Hog
5838
3m
Squad numbers
Warrior Wing
8
5m
Pre Season - 2025
Hasbag
202
5m
Rumours thread
Khlav Kalash
2516
6m
Game - Song Titles
Boss Hog
40832
7m
Getting a new side to gel
Highlander
8
9m
2025 Kit
bowlinboy
13
9m
2025 Recruitment
bowlinboy
228
FORUM
NEW
TOPICS
TOPIC
POSTER
POSTS
TODAY
England Women Las Vegas train-on squad
RLFANS News
1
TODAY
Quiz night
H.G.S.A
1
TODAY
Co-Captains for 2025
MjM
15
TODAY
Cornwall has a new owner
CM Punk
2
TODAY
Callum Shaw
Wanderer
1
TODAY
Squad Numbers
phe13
4
TODAY
Rhinos squad numbers
Rixy
1
TODAY
Squad numbers
Warrior Wing
8
TODAY
Mat Crowther pre season update
Dunkirk Spir
1
TODAY
Mike Cooper podcast
Wires71
10
TODAY
Shirt reveal coming soon
vastman
48
TODAY
Opening Championship and League One Fixtures for 2025 Released
RLFANS News
1
NEWS ITEMS
VIEWS


Visit the RLFANS.COM SHOP
for more merchandise!












.