Post subject: Re: Cameron reprimanded for false claim on debt
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 10:30 am
Hull White Star
Player Coach
Joined: Nov 19 2005 Posts: 2359 Location: Marys Place, near the River, in Nebraska, Waitin' on A Sunny Day
samwire wrote:if it's a yes/no answer, then the answer is 'no'. it's that sodding easy. you've already said you don't get chance to explain anything. so why the hell do you want to?
as for the last bit, you're a true conspiracy theorist. or if you're that bothered, wear a disguise.
Are you really suggesting I ask all of my health care professionals to lie in their reports I have to send to ATOS and say I can't walk 20m all of the time and are you really suggesting I commit fraud and pretend to be someone I'm not
You Tories need to make your minds up; either us disabled tell the truth and back it up with medical reports (if we are truly disabled we have nothing to fear, right?) or I tell blantent obvious lies and get Doctors, nurses, physios, surgeons and consultants to do the same just so I can retain a car??????? I must be dreaming
A dog is the only thing on earth that loves you more than he loves himself.
When you rescue a dog, you gain a heart for life.
Handle every situation like a dog. If you can't Eat it or Chew it. Pee on it and Walk Away.
"No amount of cajolery, and no attempts at ethical or social seduction, can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred for the Tory Party. So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin. " Anuerin Bevan
Post subject: Re: Cameron reprimanded for false claim on debt
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 12:25 pm
samwire
International Board Member
Joined: Sep 04 2002 Posts: 335 Location: Chester
Hull White Star wrote:Are you really suggesting I ask all of my health care professionals to lie in their reports I have to send to ATOS and say I can't walk 20m all of the time and are you really suggesting I commit fraud and pretend to be someone I'm not
you have 2 possible choices, yes or no. there is no midway point as you yourself have pointed out. so, you're basically lying whichever one you choose.
TotalRl.com - Home of Stupid Questions, Friday Pix and of course Millward is a Gurner.
Post subject: Re: Cameron reprimanded for false claim on debt
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 1:08 pm
JerryChicken
International Star
Joined: Jul 09 2012 Posts: 3605 Location: Leeds
samwire wrote:you have 2 possible choices, yes or no. there is no midway point as you yourself have pointed out. so, you're basically lying whichever one you choose.
No she is not, if the question is phrased in such a manner as to make a "no" outcome very difficult to achieve then "yes" is the only answer applicable.
And there is the crux of the matter, the question is phrased in such a manner as to achieve a "yes" answer in a huge proportion of replies, what it doesn't do is take into account any other mitigating circumstances - "Can you occasionally achieve mobility over 20 metres ?" will achieve a "yes" answer from the vast majority of claimants, even those for whom doing that once a month would be a massive achievement.
I don't really understand why you don't see that.
Well I do, but we live in hope.
Someday everything is gonna be different, when I paint my masterpiece ---------------------------------------------------------- Online art gallery, selling original landscape artwork ---------------------------------------------------------- JerryChicken - The Blog ----------------------------------------------------------
Post subject: Re: Cameron reprimanded for false claim on debt
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 1:09 pm
Hull White Star
Player Coach
Joined: Nov 19 2005 Posts: 2359 Location: Marys Place, near the River, in Nebraska, Waitin' on A Sunny Day
samwire wrote:you have 2 possible choices, yes or no. there is no midway point as you yourself have pointed out. so, you're basically lying whichever one you choose.
Bingo!! You've finally realised the stupidness of it all!! The majority of the people who are already claiming high rate will now lose it all (with the exception of the permanent wheelchair bound) all because this stupid government don't or won't recognise there is an inbetween in almost all disabilities and illnessess.
Having read back what I've just written, on second thoughts I don't believe this government are stupid, I think they know exactly what they are doing.
A dog is the only thing on earth that loves you more than he loves himself.
When you rescue a dog, you gain a heart for life.
Handle every situation like a dog. If you can't Eat it or Chew it. Pee on it and Walk Away.
"No amount of cajolery, and no attempts at ethical or social seduction, can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred for the Tory Party. So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin. " Anuerin Bevan
Post subject: Re: Cameron reprimanded for false claim on debt
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 3:22 pm
samwire
International Board Member
Joined: Sep 04 2002 Posts: 335 Location: Chester
JerryChicken wrote:No she is not, if the question is phrased in such a manner as to make a "no" outcome very difficult to achieve then "yes" is the only answer applicable.
And there is the crux of the matter, the question is phrased in such a manner as to achieve a "yes" answer in a huge proportion of replies, what it doesn't do is take into account any other mitigating circumstances - "Can you occasionally achieve mobility over 20 metres ?" will achieve a "yes" answer from the vast majority of claimants, even those for whom doing that once a month would be a massive achievement.
I don't really understand why you don't see that.
Well I do, but we live in hope.
Quote:http://www.disabilityrightsuk.org/f60.htm
Quote:Activity 2. Moving around. a. Can stand and then move more than 200 metres, either aided or unaided. - Score 0
b. Can stand and then move more than 50 metres but no more than 200 metres, either aided or unaided. - Score 4
c. Can stand and then move unaided more than 20 metres but no more than 50 metres. - Score 8
d. Can stand and then move using an aid or appliance more than 20 metres but no more than 50 metres. - Score 10
e. Can stand and then move more than 1 metre but no more than 20 metres, either aided or unaided. - Score 12
f. Cannot, either aided or unaided, (i) stand; or (ii) move more than 1 metre. - Score 12
TotalRl.com - Home of Stupid Questions, Friday Pix and of course Millward is a Gurner.
Post subject: Re: Cameron reprimanded for false claim on debt
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 4:12 pm
JerryChicken
International Star
Joined: Jul 09 2012 Posts: 3605 Location: Leeds
El Barbudo wrote:I don't see any mention of pain / discomfort / recovery time required / repeatability etc etc.
... use of medication, variation under medication, type of terrain, stairs, etc, etc.
There's no consideration for fluctuation of ability either.
Someday everything is gonna be different, when I paint my masterpiece ---------------------------------------------------------- Online art gallery, selling original landscape artwork ---------------------------------------------------------- JerryChicken - The Blog ----------------------------------------------------------
Post subject: Re: Cameron reprimanded for false claim on debt
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 4:36 pm
Hull White Star
Player Coach
Joined: Nov 19 2005 Posts: 2359 Location: Marys Place, near the River, in Nebraska, Waitin' on A Sunny Day
El Barbudo wrote:I don't see any mention of pain / discomfort / recovery time required / repeatability etc etc.
JerryChicken wrote:... use of medication, variation under medication, type of terrain, stairs, etc, etc.
There's no consideration for fluctuation of ability either.
You won't because what Samwire is failing to mention is none of what you have both mentioned are taken into consideration. You are given the option of yes/no. Thats it, no inbetween.
A dog is the only thing on earth that loves you more than he loves himself.
When you rescue a dog, you gain a heart for life.
Handle every situation like a dog. If you can't Eat it or Chew it. Pee on it and Walk Away.
"No amount of cajolery, and no attempts at ethical or social seduction, can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred for the Tory Party. So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin. " Anuerin Bevan
Post subject: Re: Cameron reprimanded for false claim on debt
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 5:18 pm
samwire
International Board Member
Joined: Sep 04 2002 Posts: 335 Location: Chester
El Barbudo wrote:I don't see any mention of pain / discomfort / recovery time required / repeatability etc etc.
*sigh*
Quote:For a descriptor to apply you must be able to complete the activity as described in the descriptor:
safely to an acceptable standard repeatedly; and in a reasonable time period.
The term “safely” means in a manner unlikely to cause harm to you or to another person, either during or after completion of the activity
The term “repeatedly” means as often as the activity being assessed is reasonably required to be completed.
When deciding this a decision maker should take into account any pain, breathlessness or tiredness you feel when carrying out an activity.
A decision maker will also take into account any aid or appliance you normally wear or use or could reasonably be expected to wear or use when assessing your ability to carry out a descriptor.
If you have a fluctuating condition the most appropriate descriptor will be the one which is likely to apply for the greatest proportion of that time.
If you are waiting for further treatment, the descriptor that applies to you will be based on your existing situation rather than based on assumptions about any future improvement in your health.
TotalRl.com - Home of Stupid Questions, Friday Pix and of course Millward is a Gurner.
Post subject: Re: Cameron reprimanded for false claim on debt
Posted: Thu Feb 07, 2013 5:22 pm
samwire
International Board Member
Joined: Sep 04 2002 Posts: 335 Location: Chester
Hull White Star wrote:You won't because what Samwire is failing to mention is none of what you have both mentioned are taken into consideration. You are given the option of yes/no. Thats it, no inbetween.
i'm sorry, but unless the info in the link is utter rubbish, then it isn't just yes/no. you have several choices and you are also able to take into account personal situations. ffs.
TotalRl.com - Home of Stupid Questions, Friday Pix and of course Millward is a Gurner.
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