You've mentioned this encounter several times. Please, elaborate. I'm interested as what form an encounter with Jesus takes. Was it a dream? An apparition?


You miss the point. Your chosen god is the Christian god. That's down to nothing more than the circumstances of your birth and the path your life has taken. Just as the paths of billions of others mean they follow other gods and faiths. A Muslim child may follow a similar path in a different part of the world and be just as sure in their faith as you are yours.

How about a child born to a remote Amazonian tribe? Doomed to hell before they even draw breath? What sort of God are you worshipping here?


Hang on, you said god has already chosen who to save, regardless. But now faith gets you into heaven?

Faith is something we choose to have, or to deny. It is an act of free will. Therefore your free will, your choice to believe and have faith, is what gets you into heaven.


Oh right, so now God grants faith? That sounds a lot like supernatural brainwashing. As I said above, surely faith is something we choose to have or to deny. If not, your god is forcing your faith upon you. Not sure I like the sound of that.

So please tell me, if nothing we can do can earn us a place in heaven, what was the point of Jesus? What was that little saga all about? It all seems utterly pointless if the saved have already been chosen.


That scripture is also contradictory in places.


You're saying that this collections of ancient myths and legends passed down over many centuries, and accounts of a man allegedly called Jesus selected by various religious figures over the Councils of Nicea and over the centuries, translated and mis-translated many hundreds of times is ALL the work of the Holy Spirit?

So which version of the bible is THE correct one? They all differ to varying degrees as proven by the other point you ignored, the work 'tekton', mistakenly translated as 'carpenter' for much of Western history.

And why is it that millions have died over the petty details of the bible if god has guided what was included. If god and his holy spirit are key in putting the bible together, why didn't god ensure every translation of the bible was perfect and thus avoid those devastating disputes?

And why didn't god simply destroy all the "false" gospels that have come to light? In fact perhaps the opposite is true: he ensured they survived to be discovered by future generations.


The bible weaves the concept of free will throughout, from Genesis in fact. Adam and Eve were told not to do something and warned of the consequences of their actions. Despite this, they exercised free will and went against god's wishes. Free will, in the bible, from the off.

The bible has many verses which strongly show that mankind has the responsibility to exercise his free will and is commanded by god to do so:
John 1:12
2 Peter 3:9
1 Timothy 2:4
Deuteronomy 30:11
Deuteronomy 30:15
John 14:15
John 15:7
Romans 2:10
1 Corinthians 9:24
1 Timothy 6:12
2 Timothy 2:21
1 John 5:1


I have no doubt your god, in your interpretation, chooses who to save. What I question (aside from the whole concept of a god) is your assertion that he has predetermined his list of those to be saved, and that nothing anyone does can change that. Except have faith, of course, which, again according to your interpretation, is only given by god.


That doesn't appear to be the case. A true critical examination of Christianity and the bible would find many flaws in the tradition and much to question.


You're definitely sounding Westboro.

Kirkstaller, one quick and simple question.

Is your god the only true god, does he exist where Allah (Or Odin for that matter) doesn't? Without reading the Koran, how can you say that your bible is the only word of god?


(BTW you don't want to argue with me, my brother is coming over in a minute and he's much bigger than me...)

I know I have also been guilty of encouraging this guy, but seriously this is getting creepy. There are some scary delusional issues going on here and I'm not comfortable talking to this guy any more. We should not be doing this. If you're not locking, I'm blocking, because there is something not right here.

Matthew 1:24



Matthew 2:1

Sounds to me like they lived in Bethlehem. Nazareth isn't mentioned in Matthew until after they come back from Egypt/Isreal (depending on which interpretation you use. That's the New International version quoted there.



Matthew 2:23 from the King James version. Odd wording if they lived in Nazareth prior to Jesus' birth.



Matthew 2:22 from the same. Why would they return to Bethlehem if they lived in Nazareth.

No.

I think he a cross between the two.

I'd be amazed if he wasn't genuine.

If he is genuine, he needs help. If he really, seriously believes all of the things he's posted on here, he's almost certainly mentally ill. Or exceptionally unpleasant. Perhaps even both.

This thread is conclusive proof that the Sin Bin is full of complete and utter nutters.

It is also highly amusing.

Think of his children, poor nice people.