Post subject: Re: Breivik sane, must serve a minimum of 10 years
Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 1:15 pm
John_D
International Chairman
Joined: Feb 21 2002 Posts: 31779 Location: The commentary box
DaveO wrote:I think when anyone considered sane did as he did I do not know how you could trust any remorse they show to be genuine.
I think we're all in agreement on this. Yes, in this specific case it looks unlikely, at best, that he'll ever be rehabilitated, but it's also absolutely right to allow for the possibility.
Advice is what we seek when we already know the answer - but wish we didn't
I'd rather have a full bottle in front of me than a full-frontal lobotomy ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ kirkstaller wrote: "All DNA shows is that we have a common creator."
cod'ead wrote: "I have just snotted weissbier all over my keyboard & screen"
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ "No amount of cajolery, and no attempts at ethical or social seduction, can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred for the Tory Party. So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin." - Aneurin Bevan
Quote:The law demands a minimum period to be established which cannot be longer than 10 years. The court may extend the time-frame by up to five years at a time when the risk of serious re-offending is still considered to be present. This implies that preventive detention in principle may lead to a life-time in prison
The reason for the minimum of 10 years is that in fact under Swedish law it is a maximum. In this particular case it indicates that after 10 years he'd be back up before the Court every 5 years for them to add another stretch.
It still does, however theoretically, leave a possibility - however remote - that he would be released in as little as 10 years but but hey ho, their country, their law.
cod'ead wrote:An interesting tweet on the subject:
Quote:The law demands a minimum period to be established which cannot be longer than 10 years. The court may extend the time-frame by up to five years at a time when the risk of serious re-offending is still considered to be present. This implies that preventive detention in principle may lead to a life-time in prison
The reason for the minimum of 10 years is that in fact under Swedish law it is a maximum. In this particular case it indicates that after 10 years he'd be back up before the Court every 5 years for them to add another stretch.
It still does, however theoretically, leave a possibility - however remote - that he would be released in as little as 10 years but but hey ho, their country, their law.
Last edited by Ferocious Aardvark on stardate Jun 26, 3013 11:27 am, edited 48,562,867,458,300,023 times in total
Advice is what we seek when we already know the answer - but wish we didn't
I'd rather have a full bottle in front of me than a full-frontal lobotomy ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ kirkstaller wrote: "All DNA shows is that we have a common creator."
cod'ead wrote: "I have just snotted weissbier all over my keyboard & screen"
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ "No amount of cajolery, and no attempts at ethical or social seduction, can eradicate from my heart a deep burning hatred for the Tory Party. So far as I am concerned they are lower than vermin." - Aneurin Bevan
Post subject: Re: Breivik sane, must serve a minimum of 10 years
Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 3:28 pm
Ferocious Aardvark
International Chairman
Joined: Feb 17 2002 Posts: 28357 Location: MACS0647-JD
cod'ead wrote:With Norway having a (per capita) prison population less than half that of Great Britain, I doubt we're in any position to criticise.
..
OTOH if even for 77 murders you can get out in 10 years - is that surprising? I bet if the maximum prison term in England was 24 hours, we'd have the smallest prison pop in the world
Last edited by Ferocious Aardvark on stardate Jun 26, 3013 11:27 am, edited 48,562,867,458,300,023 times in total
Post subject: Re: Breivik sane, must serve a minimum of 10 years
Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 4:11 pm
DaveO
Moderator
Joined: Dec 22 2001 Posts: 14395 Location: Chester
Ferocious Aardvark wrote:In this particular case it indicates that after 10 years he'd be back up before the Court every 5 years for them to add another stretch.
It still does, however theoretically, leave a possibility - however remote - that he would be released in as little as 10 years but but hey ho, their country, their law.
It also means every five years the relatives have it all dragged up again as they also consider the remote possibility he may be released.
The likes of Jon Wessel-Aas can tweet what they like but I bet they have not considered that.
I will readily accept the the likes of Norway and Sweden generally have better penal systems that we do but this five year review thing says to me those systems aren't well suited to dealing with the aftermath of a crime like this.
Last league derby at Central Park 5/9/1999: Wigan 28 St. Helens 20 Last league derby at Knowsley Road 2/4/2010: St. Helens 10 Wigan 18
Post subject: Re: Breivik sane, must serve a minimum of 10 years
Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 4:26 pm
Mintball
All Time Great
Joined: May 10 2002 Posts: 47951 Location: Die Metropole
DaveO wrote:It also means every five years the relatives have it all dragged up again as they also consider the remote possibility he may be released.
The likes of Jon Wessel-Aas can tweet what they like but I bet they have not considered that.
I will readily accept the the likes of Norway and Sweden generally have better penal systems that we do but this five year review thing says to me those systems aren't well suited to dealing with the aftermath of a crime like this.
I'd suggest that few countries' judicial systems are "suited to dealing with the aftermath of a crime like this".
And you only make bad law if you make law on the basis of a single case.
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Post subject: Re: Breivik sane, must serve a minimum of 10 years
Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2012 4:47 pm
Mad_Jack_Mcmad
Club Coach
Joined: Jun 15 2005 Posts: 1305
Ferocious Aardvark wrote:My point was on the minimum sentence. The rest of it is all just their system, but let's say he did repent, regret, whatever, and was totally reformed, and would never do the same again, even so, in my opinion, 10 years for shooting 77 people dead is nowhere near enough.
Given the Norwegian (!) maximum is 21 years - what do you have to do to be told that is what you must serve? I would have thought that randomly killing dozens of innocent people to protest at government policy would be a banker for being told, "Soz, that's a s bad as it gets, you win the 21 year full stretch".
You have to kill Euronymous and burn down four wooden churches ala Varg Vikernes (although he got let out after 16 years on parole).
Ferocious Aardvark wrote:My point was on the minimum sentence. The rest of it is all just their system, but let's say he did repent, regret, whatever, and was totally reformed, and would never do the same again, even so, in my opinion, 10 years for shooting 77 people dead is nowhere near enough.
Given the Norwegian (!) maximum is 21 years - what do you have to do to be told that is what you must serve? I would have thought that randomly killing dozens of innocent people to protest at government policy would be a banker for being told, "Soz, that's a s bad as it gets, you win the 21 year full stretch".
You have to kill Euronymous and burn down four wooden churches ala Varg Vikernes (although he got let out after 16 years on parole).
Somewhere in the dust of time rest the bones of the Galilean He who was spat upon. He whose face was marred beyond all human likeness Somewhere buried among the lies of the past rests the tomb of Yeshua Of he who was made God in a world without Hope. And when this son of Joseph is found. What then will the Church of Rome say? Prepare yourself for the day is coming. And men will say "Blessed are the wasted lives who perished in the flames of the holy war"
Post subject: Re: Breivik sane, must serve a minimum of 10 years
Posted: Sun Aug 26, 2012 10:00 pm
The Video Ref
Club Owner
Joined: Feb 29 2004 Posts: 4195
I confess to knowing next to nothing about their legal system, but from what I have read in the papers Breivik is going to do 21 years (the maximum) and then some, at the Court's discretion.
There is no realistic possibility this guy is going to be out and about in 10 years.
Post subject: Re: Breivik sane, must serve a minimum of 10 years
Posted: Sun Aug 26, 2012 10:16 pm
Live Wired
Player Coach
Joined: Feb 12 2009 Posts: 1521
eeeeeeeeeeeeer he is a self confessed child killer. only option available is to extinguish his own life. no loss to anyone except the people who have his own warped sense of life.
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