Dudley wrote:There you go again, judging people just because their views don't fit in with yours. You may be educated to degree standard, it doesn't stop you being a bigot. P.S I hope you show a little more tollerance towards the drug addicts you've worked with as I would assume due to the nature of their addictions they may have had to do some fairly unsavoury things to feed their habits.
berrigans bitch wrote:Clearly your morals are just as bad as your values! You are correct I could be considered Mrs Goody Two shoes, you see I have always known right from wrong so I hanve managed the last 40 odd years mistake free! I do believe people can change and should be given the support and resources to do so[/b[b]]...However Ben Cockayne should have gone to prison, he did not and your club stood by him for his sickening crime, he repaid your club by displaying racist behaviour, he clearly has not matured and has shown no gratitude to the people who supported him and gave him the second chance...simple fact he is scum and always will be.
Oh I forgot I am educated to degree level, I was raised on a council estate (North Hull), I have worked with drug addict, offenders, victims of crime to name a few...
What kind of cockeyed view you have, on the one hand you say you believe that people can change and should be given all the support and resources to do so and then in your next breath you pretty much contradict yourself by saying that in Ben Cockaynes case he should have been jailed, if thats not hypocrisy than i dont know what is. Oh by the way, was the fact that you stated you were brought up in a North Hull housing estate and educated to degree level supposed to impress me, if it was then you failed, ive known plenty of people who have obtained various degrees including my ex who worked in the medical proffesion, it would be safe to say that they are not always the smartest people, oh i almost forgot, i also was educated at a North Hull school and brought up on a council estate if thats supposed to count for something. I notice that you said you have (past tense) worked with Drug addicts, offenders,etc, so i presume you may have been and possibly still are working for social services in some capacity, in which case i dont think your use of the word scum to describe someone who represents the very people you are supposed to be assisting would fit in with the groups ethos.
Joined: Jan 02 2003 Posts: 43413 Location: rlfans flying wing man
Roverswall wrote:I often wonder what Ben thinks of all this. There is 2 sides to it. 1 he isn't the smartest cookie in the jar. 2 he may well be starting to think he is bulletproof.
Us letting him go may be the best thing for HIM as it may make him face up to his problems.
With the grestest of respect to anyone Ben has a self destructive attitude and it will raise its head again.
Him signing for somebody else shouldn't matter it is what he has done whilst playing at HKR that doesn't sit well with me
Just like us and Raynor and probably Tansey
As good a player as they are, the club made the correct decisions on both
Joined: Mar 25 2008 Posts: 3679 Location: God's county
WormInHand wrote:Ok. I'm assuming from your post that you have committed similar offences to Cockeyed?
Once convicted - would you have behaved like Cockeyed and re-offended again? Or, would you have learned? By all accounts you did. So did I. Cockeyed hasn't.
Please don't compare yourself to him him. He's not humble and still thinks he's great. His job doesn't help him with that. That's the difference between you and him.
Other than the assault, what offence has he committed?
What immortal hand or eye, Dare frame thy fearful symmetry?
Joined: Jan 08 2006 Posts: 2192 Location: Somewhere in the Stratosphere.
ComeOnYouUll wrote:Ironic on a thread about Cockayne.
Surely the irony works both ways. An intolerant poster, getting her door down about people defending Cockayne when he's posted intolerant views, funny old world innit?
Seventies red wrote:What kind of cockeyed view you have, on the one hand you say you believe that people can change and should be given all the support and resources to do so and then in your next breath you pretty much contradict yourself by saying that in Ben Cockaynes case he should have been jailed, if thats not hypocrisy than i dont know what is. Oh by the way, was the fact that you stated you were brought up in a North Hull housing estate and educated to degree level supposed to impress me, if it was then you failed, ive known plenty of people who have obtained various degrees including my ex who worked in the medical proffesion, it would be safe to say that they are not always the smartest people, oh i almost forgot, i also was educated at a North Hull school and brought up on a council estate if thats supposed to count for something. I notice that you said you have (past tense) worked with Drug addicts, offenders,etc, so i presume you may have been and possibly still are working for social services in some capacity, in which case i dont think your use of the word scum to describe someone who represents the very people you are supposed to be assisting would fit in with the groups ethos.
I stated where I was brought up and my education in responce to your post, I have no need to impress you. You dismissed Bens offences as misdemenours, I think most people smart or not realise beating some-one to near death is more than a misdemenour, most people also understand that people with a priveledge job like Ben's would feel some embarassment, shame, and realise how lucky they are put there head down and get on with their job of rebuilding their lives. This has not happened with Ben, he then decides to post racist comments knowing he has over 1000 followers on facebook. I have worked with many offenders the majority committing crime due to their drug addiction, the one's who get clean generally feel shame for their past, and go on to lead normal lives. Ben Cockayne is not an indivdual who feels any remorse, if he did he would not have displayed his racism in such a public arena.Ben's name is chanted by thousands of people in a staduim most weeks, his arrogance shines through whilst he staggers about the pitch soaking up this addulation. I do not work for social serivces though have many friends who do, most would agree with me that Ben is scum, MR mentioned role models and his opinion is that he does not buy into it, fair enough, however 1000s of youngsters are there chanting Ben's name, people like yourself are on here defending him...people refering to him as a legend!!..He is not a teenager on the wrong path, he is not a drug addict, he is actually a man who does not have to scrimp and scrap to meet the needs of his family, he is in his 30s!!..at what point is he going to realise he made mistakes etc like you indicate ? I would be ashamed to chant his name every week and would be more ashamed if children where present, tell me what explanations do poeple give to their children about idolising a racist thug? How do you consider Bens,s victim feels about 1000s chanting his name ? How do you consider ethinic minorites feel about Ben's behaviour ? How do you consider people like me with normal morals feel about Ben's behaviour ? I
Joined: Aug 14 2005 Posts: 14302 Location: On the Death Star Awaiting Luke.
berrigans bitch wrote:I stated where I was brought up and my education in responce to your post, I have no need to impress you. You dismissed Bens offences as misdemenours, I think most people smart or not realise beating some-one to near death is more than a misdemenour, most people also understand that people with a priveledge job like Ben's would feel some embarassment, shame, and realise how lucky they are put there head down and get on with their job of rebuilding their lives. This has not happened with Ben, he then decides to post racist comments knowing he has over 1000 followers on facebook. I have worked with many offenders the majority committing crime due to their drug addiction, the one's who get clean generally feel shame for their past, and go on to lead normal lives. Ben Cockayne is not an indivdual who feels any remorse, if he did he would not have displayed his racism in such a public arena.Ben's name is chanted by thousands of people in a staduim most weeks, his arrogance shines through whilst he staggers about the pitch soaking up this addulation. I do not work for social serivces though have many friends who do, most would agree with me that Ben is scum, MR mentioned role models and his opinion is that he does not buy into it, fair enough, however 1000s of youngsters are there chanting Ben's name, people like yourself are on here defending him...people refering to him as a legend!!..He is not a teenager on the wrong path, he is not a drug addict, he is actually a man who does not have to scrimp and scrap to meet the needs of his family, he is in his 30s!!..at what point is he going to realise he made mistakes etc like you indicate ? I would be ashamed to chant his name every week and would be more ashamed if children where present, tell me what explanations do poeple give to their children about idolising a racist thug? How do you consider Bens,s victim feels about 1000s chanting his name ? How do you consider ethinic minorites feel about Ben's behaviour ? How do you consider people like me with normal morals feel about Ben's behaviour ? I
With the greatest of respect and I have given my views on this you are coming across as holiest that thou on this thread, That doesn't always sit will with folks.
I've stated my opinions on Ben numerous times and still haven't changed my opinion that the club did the wrong thing by not sacking him after the facebook affair. We didn't, he played on and the club decided to internally discipline him which in my view tainted both the club and the sport a bit. This now puts us, and my views, in a very tricky position. Not renewing his contract would not really do much in the way of making a statement. He'd go, get a decent contract elsewhere and it would be almost as if he was just let go. The impact to make a statement of us not tolerating this kind of behaviour was lost on the day of the KC derby. Because of this I think he'll get the new contract his playing deserves but his behaviour doesn't. I wont be chanting charlie, I don;t like to hear people chanting it, but they will because he's almost become a folk hero for reasons that are beyond me.
Just to say seventies red posted some valid points and actually made me think about some of the things I did in my past and how I'm a completely different character now to when I was 18 and to some extents 27 (BC's age). I find myself looking at antics of some turning my nose up in disgust without thinking that maybe I wasn't massively dissimilar at a younger age. I got given a chance, maybe this BC's very last one.
Put it this way, he's got an extremely long way to go before I'll do anymore than clap a try he scores and no doubt time will tell if he manages to keep his nose clean.
berrigans bitch wrote:I stated where I was brought up and my education in responce to your post, I have no need to impress you. You dismissed Bens offences as misdemenours, I think most people smart or not realise beating some-one to near death is more than a misdemenour, most people also understand that people with a priveledge job like Ben's would feel some embarassment, shame, and realise how lucky they are put there head down and get on with their job of rebuilding their lives. This has not happened with Ben, he then decides to post racist comments knowing he has over 1000 followers on facebook. I have worked with many offenders the majority committing crime due to their drug addiction, the one's who get clean generally feel shame for their past, and go on to lead normal lives. Ben Cockayne is not an indivdual who feels any remorse, if he did he would not have displayed his racism in such a public arena.Ben's name is chanted by thousands of people in a staduim most weeks, his arrogance shines through whilst he staggers about the pitch soaking up this addulation. I do not work for social serivces though have many friends who do, most would agree with me that Ben is scum, MR mentioned role models and his opinion is that he does not buy into it, fair enough, however 1000s of youngsters are there chanting Ben's name, people like yourself are on here defending him...people refering to him as a legend!!..He is not a teenager on the wrong path, he is not a drug addict, he is actually a man who does not have to scrimp and scrap to meet the needs of his family, he is in his 30s!!..at what point is he going to realise he made mistakes etc like you indicate ? I would be ashamed to chant his name every week and would be more ashamed if children where present, tell me what explanations do poeple give to their children about idolising a racist thug? How do you consider Bens,s victim feels about 1000s chanting his name ? How do you consider ethinic minorites feel about Ben's behaviour ? How do you consider people like me with normal morals feel about Ben's behaviour ? I
Burn him!... and then the gypsies and the Jews eh?
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