England need some kind of lead, no matter how small, even 20/30 would be useful, if we are trailing on first inngs then I can't see us winning it.

It might well be as close as the Lewis v Taylor match

I do actually think you're right though. Don't fancy having to chase down anything over 250 batting last.

SA batting well now, not looking good for England.

Looks like someone is going to have to do an 'atherton' and bat for a long time to save the game.

It's got the look of a defeat hasn't it ? Sadly.

I just hope we go down fighting, give them a scare. When they set circa 450 to win, get to like 230-2 like so that they plop it for an hour in the field like. It won't happen, we'll be 38-3 before KP plays a few shots and then a bad one, but we can dream can't we.

If someone could get a big hundred, and get folk batting around them, y'never know I guess, all three results will be possible from a time perspective. All the england top 9 look in reasonable nick, you just need a hero to emerge.

Maybe there's a headline to be written by KP, Errr, maybe not.

Sa will bat Eng out of it, cant see them setting less than 500 as a target. Did the wicket get easier or did Eng just not bowl that well? The contrast between our 3 very similar seam bowlers and the extra hostility of Morkel & Steyn was quite marked. Bloody hot though, not surprised we wilted in the heat.

Didn't see much of today, but to be honest, in our first innings, our batsman seemed to get themselves out rather than the SA attack being particularly hostile.

Smith can't delay his declaration too long, he has to give his attack enough time to do the job, so expect a bit of shot making in the hour up to lunch, and I think he'll set us 450-470 to win in 5 sessions (give or take an over or 3).

As JWP says, let's just hope we make a good show of it, and don't just fold feebly....Not expecting a miracle, but at least let's get them to the final session on the final day...

I think Smith will look to set us at least 500 to win, and to bat us right out of the game even though they need the win more than we do. The biggest worry is that they were scoring so quickly today; the last thing we need is for them to put on another 150 or so by lunch tomorrow. If it takes them the best part of two further sessions to set the sort of target they're looking for we can then take the view that if they can bat for a day and a half in their second innings so can we. These are two fairly well matched teams overall. Their best two batsmen have fired in this one. Pietersen must be due a big innings now, and the rest of the batting is capable of putting together the significant partnerships needed to save the game even if we're unlikely to have a realistic chance of winning it.

Well I hope England can come back from the dead like Australia have just done. They should have been buried into defeat late on day 3 at 257 for 8 but battled to 381 all out to set Pakistan 178 to win and have ended up winning late on day 4! Not many sides come back from being bowled out first innings for 127!

Great result for Aus. I can't see England doing the same, the minimum we will have to chase is 400 but realisitcally it will be 500.