kim-or-lee wrote:Well no of course not, but if you answered the question it would give me an idea of what levels you are basing your assertions and opinions on. i.e. if you've not bought into a tournament for more than a tenner or something then I'll not really disagree with anything you've said
Low stakes mainly. I've only been playing about a year so I'm not ready to throw all my cash away just yet
kim-or-lee wrote:Indeed but luck on an overall scale in poker is just as integral to cash games as it is to tournaments, skill overrides luck the higher you get in the main but yeah as you said with a tournament when you're out you're out and that's that really so ho hum.
Which was my point all along, in order to win, or even go deep, in a tournament you are probably going to have win a few coin flips which is where the luck comes in. I'm not saying skill isn't involved but a bad piece of luck early on and you dont have the chance to come back from it. You dont generally "go out" of a cash game so over the longer period of time the luck will even itself out and the skill becomes the difference.
kim-or-lee wrote:You did, you said it here:
I think we have got our wires crossed. I wasn't suggesting that every hand should be played, I was suggesting that when a player is involved in a hand they would be looking to maximise profit. Whilst the same is true in tournament play I'd suggest its possibly more important in cah games.
kim-or-lee wrote:Tbh I think we're comparing completely different levels here, If you're talking about those $10 buy-in's you get online where the overall prize pool is easily over $1,000 then I suppose you're right yeah but for someone to have that kind of mentality in a tournament I don't think you can make a comparison to someone playing in a cash game with £200 involved in one hand.
I only picked £200 as an example figure. Someone may be willing to pay say $10 to enter a tournament and play quite loose in order to double through etc to try and get the big rewards because they know the most they will lose is the original $10 stake. If its raised to say $20 dollars pre-flop in a cash game would the same player risk that $20 dollars to try and out play his opponent after the flop? Again I'm not saying both formats dont require skill but far more of the less skillful players are involved in tournaments and will get lucky against the better player from time to time.
kim-or-lee wrote:We'll have to agree to disagree there. To last a few days in a tournament takes a ridiculous amount of discipline and mental stamina, especially when you can be sometimes playing till 4/5/6am from lunchtime but certainly to be a winning cash game player requires an immense amount of skill
I'm certainly not saying skill isn't involved for tournament play but IMO luck plays a larger role in that format.
Quick story - I was watching a WPT final table the other week. Nick Schulman hit top pair after the flop (Queens) he bets and an Internet Qualifier calls, The turn brings Schulman 2 pair so he bets again and again the Internet Qualifies calls. The river comes as something like 5 of spades so again Schulman bets (these have all been big bets) and the Internet Qualifier calls with what he thinks is King high. Schulman flips over his 2 pair and the qualifier flips over his cards and says "king high" its only when the dealer points out that he actually made the flush on the river he realises he has won a very big pot. He then went on to win the tournament
