I retract that statement then, time for bed.

Both Lockers and Hock will play when we go to HKR in two weeks.
We do need to strengthen the pack though. Only Feka out of our front row is busting a tackle. We have three front rowers who can't break a tackle and that's why there's no go forward and no one make plays behind them.
Both Lockers and Hock break tackles, of the other back rowers neither Hansen, Joel or Bailey is doing it.
Time to bring Mossop back. If our front row can't give us go forward maybe a more forceful 2nd row can. Mossop is playing each week under Nathan Brown and he's no idiot. Mossop is obviously ready for SL standard rugby.
A back row of Hock, Mossop & Lockers could be quite brilliant. Big, powerful and skillful.
IL needs to pull his finger out and find a prop. We've needed props since before he bought the club but he hasn't signed a single one despite it being our priority.

Does this not highlights one of the problems at Wigan that none of us can think of a leader on the field better than Thomas Leuluai (23)? Imagine what it is like on the field then with no recognised player with some sort of authority and leadership. We have a very young team and although people are really keen on Richie Myler we would need a player of experience to come in at prop forward then as well otherwise we will lack experience and leadership in games when we need it. Especially since two of our "senior" players are expected to leave at the end of the season in Phil Bailey and Andy Coley.

Dave, none of that makes sense. As usual on this subject you've just read what you wanted in order to make your point. A) I never said Tommy was a bad captain...I don't know whether he is or not. B) He was the designated 2nd choice and presided over a debacle. C) I have yet to hear a viable alternatve from all the posters who claim O'Loghlin shouldn't be captain, and that includes you!
D)I have no idea whether TL was or wasn't 'leading by example', or more to the point, whether the players were responding to it as I wan't there. Neither were you! I am fairly sure, however, without needing to be there that whatever he did as captain was ultimately ineffectual as the result shows. I think, therefore, that it isn't unreasonable to make the conclusion that the current team are collectively responsible...unless of course you're the sort of person who prefers to find a scapegoat and place all the blame on them, in which case it was all TL's fault!

Please enlighten me as to who this mythical character at the club is, who would impact so strongly on the team that they would, at a stroke, eliminate the kind of debacle we had yesterday, if only they were made captain. I, and I'm sure many more people including Nobby, would hail you as a God if you can answer that one!

P.S please do me the honour of actually answering this question as, whenever I have asked it in the past you have skirted over it and made other facetious comments instead. All my points I will concede at a stroke if you can actually come up with an answer to this one question. Somehow I suspect, once again, you won't.

One further point on this. Does no-one else find it strange that, the usual 'blaming it on the captain' threads have failed to materialise after this defeat as they have without exception, after losses where O'Loughlin has been captain. Any of the Lockers Knockers care to explain that one?

More chance of IL himself answering that one.

neither of whom seems to impart the wisdom of their experience or be natural leaders.

I dont think the choice of capitain was the reason for the loss.
People complain when Lockers is captain and complain when he isnt - go figure!

On Saturday we really missed Lockers and Hock running towards both sides. I've watched the England game back and Hock had a stormer running out wide on the left which is what what we missed, and O'Loughlin doing similar on the right as well as keeping us stronger defensively over that right hand side could have been the difference.

With regards to the captain issue, last season Fielden was the captain when O'Loughlin was missing and he really raised his game, it was probably the best I'd seen him play for wigan and he led by example.

Cadoo, how can you say picking a 23 year old is a sign of bad times. Age doesn't come into it in my opinion if you lead by example and make your presence felt. How old was Farrell when he was made captain? He was even captain of his country at 21! And there are plenty others too that are young. Dismissing someone just on age is wrong. Just because some players are older doesn't make them a better leader. But I see your point that we haven't got anyone really in the team that we can see leading the team around and driving us on.

And apparently he still hasn't, even after his visit to Aus !!!!!

Not many Wigan fans actually saw this game. Don't you think that might have something to do with the lack of comments one way or the other? Just a thought!

Dave