It's the poor state of this team that we are now considering putting players back into the starting 13 who we once dropped cos they weren't good enough i.e Smith/Phelps.
If we are going to put these players in we need to do something different with them, i.e try them in different positions i.e Phelps at 6, or Smith teaming with Tomkins not Tommy.
Lets take a genuine look at our team and work out how to fix it.
Some of what I have to say will be harsh, and generate disagreement, but this is what I believe is best.
Richards, Roberts, Ainscough.
Here we have 3 wingers. I like all 3, especially Ainscough, but for me we are playing a winger at FB. I want them all in the 17 each week, but playing a winger at FB is a problem.
A true FB does more than kick returns, they join up in the line of attack either as a deep lying second receiver or as a 2nd centre down the same side creating an over lap, support play is also a massive part in their game. Look at how much Webb or Briscoe adds to their teams. If Pat is going to become our FB permanently he needs to spend many an hour with Radders learning the ins and outs of the role. Then maybe we can keep them all in the starting 13, but right now it's effecting our attacking options.
Gleeson and Carmont are quality centres. No issues there.
Sam Tomkins, Tommy, Tim Smith, Phelps.
The halves. This is a massive issue. Tommy is not a 7. He no longer even plays like a 7, a 7 is the biggest creative factor in any team, and to be honest we don't have one, hence why we are so flat and basically look clueless in attack.
Wigan didn't play to Sam in france, which worried me, he is a talent, skillful and knows the game, players need to play to Sam more, but it's a lot to ask of him to run the team on his own at his age behind a beaten pack, he needs help.
Smith is an interesting one, he has slick hands but has proven to have difficulty reading the game from a defensive view point, he leaves gaps in the line and has trouble tackling, at Wigan this is massive considering how little the pack protects it's players, but no long are fans expecting the world from him as they were after Barrett left, remember Tim has issues, and probably isn't great directly under the spotlight, but now the spotlight has moved it's focus to the likes of Fielden. For this reason, I think a call up maybe on the cards. For this to work he has to be teamed with Sam and not Tommy, when someone partners Tommy they have to practically run the attacking options on their own, not Tommy's fault, he's just not a 7.
Phelps needs to given a run at 6 in the reserves, see how he links up in the position, if he does well, then a call up to the first team could be on the cards, right now the halves need to be sorted a.s.a.p, against Cats no one at all took control of the team.
Front Row Fielden, Prescott, Coley, O Carroll, Riddell, Tommy, Feka, McClorum.
Fielden is doing no good for himself or the club starting or even being in the 17 each week. It's time we forgot about his salary and status and looked at him asking the question-is he good enough to get into the 17? Answer being no. He needs to either-take a rest to get himself together-mentally and physically or run it out in the reserves until he sorts himself out.
This leaves us with a starting 4 of, Prescott, O Carroll, Coley and Feka. Which, if Coley pushes on isn't too bad. Take Coley to one side and let him know he's now the experienced prop out there, he needs to step up, throw his weight about and be the pack leader, someone for the other guys to look up to. He's the man. Sports psychology is massive, this could help Coley drive on, in the last few games he's played well, lets encourage this and push on.
Prescott is young but has skills, I was pleased with his offloads after attracting several tacklers against Cats, more games and aggression is what he needs in his game.
I want to see O Carroll fired up. I want to see him hit the line like the defending him has just slapped his mother in the face, with every drive I wanna think it could potentially 'kick off' he hitting the line so hard. Then he could become the second impact prop we are looking for. Spell him with the awesome Feka, he needs to be told how much he is valued at the club, and to keep fighting on.
The speed of attack isn't there from dummy half we move up slow and fail to surprise the defensive with speed, we never drag them around the field making them work fearing our attack.
Watch how good Tommy was at 9 in the WC, at 7 he was hopeless, at 9 he was quick, had a good step and basically out played the best 9 in the world Cam Smith. With him at 9 we have speed and options and someone who can link up with the halves. He needs to be the starting 9, set the tone and push in with attacking speed, our 3/4 line is awesome, if they were getting the ball at speed it would change everything.
Riddell doesn't have the speed we need, he needs to be told if he doesn't improve his speed and fitness he's in the reserves till he proves he has a similar attacking presence to Cunningham.
McClorum just doesn't look good enough, but he's young, see where he's at come the end of the season.
Back Row Lockers, Bailey, Hock, Hansen, Joel Tomkins.
We have Hansen and Bailey who are very similar, both can tackle up and prove to be defensively strong throughout the game but offer very little in attack, Hock was missed cos he's the only second row, when Tomkins is off the field who can go forward. We had no go forward with these in the second row, the back 3, a tackle machine, a SR with go forward and a ball playing loose. V Cats we had 3 tacklers no go forward. All 3 need to be able to attack but that is the general structure.
Joel has ability I don't want people to forget how well he played as a 13 with Lockers injured, he was better at 13 that Lockers. He needs to be given the confidence by the coaching staff and played their and told he's the man for the job, go out there, link up with the 6 and 7 and become the best 13 going.
Lockers is a good SR and an OK 13, he can be the tackle machine with go forward in the SR, a back 3 with Lockers-tackle machine, Hock-SR with go forward, and Joel as a ball playing loose we have a good back 3. 3 Wiganers to boot.
My team for next week:
Richards
Roberts Gleeson Carmont Ainscough
Tomkins Smith
Coley Tommy Davies (till O Carroll is fit)
Lockers Hock
Joel Tomkins
----------------
Feka, Prescott, Riddell Hansen
Look out for Farrell in the reserves I often watch them play and he's the one to watch, if Hock is injured he's the one the start, he has more go forward than Hansen or Bailey.
Tell Smith not to worry about pressure, just go out and play with flair and attacking style, get the ball out to the backs as much as possible.
Tell Coley he's the man, get out there and be aggrestive machine, the man who the others look up to, tell him he's the man, now go out and prove it.
Tell the forwards to fight and show some balls, be men and hit the line hard.
Tell Sam to demand the ball when he wants it, to work off the back of Smith and be a fast flowing second receiver.
Tell Pat to join the centres/wingers in attack when linking up, tell him to become a deep second lying reciever further back and off set off Sam giving Smith more options.
Tell the forwards to protect Smith in defensive and flatten anyone who dares go near their half backs.
Tell Joel to link up with this brother when he can and to stand opposite side of Smith to offer himself as a second receiver on the other side of the field.
Tell Tommy speed for dummy half is everything, race up to the ball and run the other team ragged with dummy runs and force the team to play fast with quick passes from dummy half.
Tell the fans to stick in there and how proud I am to be a Wiganer and feel proud when I see so many Wigners following the men in Cherry and While through anything, gonna keep showing the players how well we play our role.
PaulM wrote:If Carmont is injured is Goulding still an option?
Gone on loan to Salford mate.
RICHARDS IS SUPERMAN!!!!
Wire_91 wrote:its your first final in about 8 years and now you ravin and rantin about it F**k off, and ill be going old trafford tomoz cheering on the saints and ill be writing on this forum givin you loads of shi* when your drying you eyes and the wire fan will be here handing out the tissues in the thousands, thats if you do take that many fans cause now it looks like its your fans who have jumped on the band wagon now your in a final, this time last year there was only 1000 people in the jjb and now its fillin up cause youve won the league hahaha proper true supporters you are
Joined: Jan 27 2005 Posts: 2687 Location: Westhoughton
Thought Phelps played well at Fullback against Saints made a couple of small mistakes but ran the ball back well and it also gave us another option with our kicking game gave him time to kick into space. Think that is where we should play him and rotate the wingers
Best Wigan No7 ever [b]Terry Newton Wigan legend RIP[/b]
Last Son of Wigan wrote:It's the poor state of this team that we are now considering putting players back into the starting 13 who we once dropped cos they weren't good enough i.e Smith/Phelps.
If we are going to put these players in we need to do something different with them, i.e try them in different positions i.e Phelps at 6, or Smith teaming with Tomkins not Tommy.
Lets take a genuine look at our team and work out how to fix it.
Some of what I have to say will be harsh, and generate disagreement, but this is what I believe is best.
Richards, Roberts, Ainscough.
Here we have 3 wingers. I like all 3, especially Ainscough, but for me we are playing a winger at FB. I want them all in the 17 each week, but playing a winger at FB is a problem.
A true FB does more than kick returns, they join up in the line of attack either as a deep lying second receiver or as a 2nd centre down the same side creating an over lap, support play is also a massive part in their game. Look at how much Webb or Briscoe adds to their teams. If Pat is going to become our FB permanently he needs to spend many an hour with Radders learning the ins and outs of the role. Then maybe we can keep them all in the starting 13, but right now it's effecting our attacking options.
Gleeson and Carmont are quality centres. No issues there. Sam Tomkins, Tommy, Tim Smith, Phelps.
The halves. This is a massive issue. Tommy is not a 7. He no longer even plays like a 7, a 7 is the biggest creative factor in any team, and to be honest we don't have one, hence why we are so flat and basically look clueless in attack. Wigan didn't play to Sam in france, which worried me, he is a talent, skillful and knows the game, players need to play to Sam more, but it's a lot to ask of him to run the team on his own at his age behind a beaten pack, he needs help. Smith is an interesting one, he has slick hands but has proven to have difficulty reading the game from a defensive view point, he leaves gaps in the line and has trouble tackling, at Wigan this is massive considering how little the pack protects it's players, but no long are fans expecting the world from him as they were after Barrett left, remember Tim has issues, and probably isn't great directly under the spotlight, but now the spotlight has moved it's focus to the likes of Fielden. For this reason, I think a call up maybe on the cards. For this to work he has to be teamed with Sam and not Tommy, when someone partners Tommy they have to practically run the attacking options on their own, not Tommy's fault, he's just not a 7.
Phelps needs to given a run at 6 in the reserves, see how he links up in the position, if he does well, then a call up to the first team could be on the cards, right now the halves need to be sorted a.s.a.p, against Cats no one at all took control of the team.
Front Row Fielden, Prescott, Coley, O Carroll, Riddell, Tommy, Feka, McClorum.
Fielden is doing no good for himself or the club starting or even being in the 17 each week. It's time we forgot about his salary and status and looked at him asking the question-is he good enough to get into the 17? Answer being no. He needs to either-take a rest to get himself together-mentally and physically or run it out in the reserves until he sorts himself out. This leaves us with a starting 4 of, Prescott, O Carroll, Coley and Feka. Which, if Coley pushes on isn't too bad. Take Coley to one side and let him know he's now the experienced prop out there, he needs to step up, throw his weight about and be the pack leader, someone for the other guys to look up to. He's the man. Sports psychology is massive, this could help Coley drive on, in the last few games he's played well, lets encourage this and push on.
Prescott is young but has skills, I was pleased with his offloads after attracting several tacklers against Cats, more games and aggression is what he needs in his game. I want to see O Carroll fired up. I want to see him hit the line like the defending him has just slapped his mother in the face, with every drive I wanna think it could potentially 'kick off' he hitting the line so hard. Then he could become the second impact prop we are looking for. Spell him with the awesome Feka, he needs to be told how much he is valued at the club, and to keep fighting on.
The speed of attack isn't there from dummy half we move up slow and fail to surprise the defensive with speed, we never drag them around the field making them work fearing our attack. Watch how good Tommy was at 9 in the WC, at 7 he was hopeless, at 9 he was quick, had a good step and basically out played the best 9 in the world Cam Smith. With him at 9 we have speed and options and someone who can link up with the halves. He needs to be the starting 9, set the tone and push in with attacking speed, our 3/4 line is awesome, if they were getting the ball at speed it would change everything. Riddell doesn't have the speed we need, he needs to be told if he doesn't improve his speed and fitness he's in the reserves till he proves he has a similar attacking presence to Cunningham. McClorum just doesn't look good enough, but he's young, see where he's at come the end of the season.
Back Row Lockers, Bailey, Hock, Hansen, Joel Tomkins.
We have Hansen and Bailey who are very similar, both can tackle up and prove to be defensively strong throughout the game but offer very little in attack, Hock was missed cos he's the only second row, when Tomkins is off the field who can go forward. We had no go forward with these in the second row, the back 3, a tackle machine, a SR with go forward and a ball playing loose. V Cats we had 3 tacklers no go forward. All 3 need to be able to attack but that is the general structure.
Joel has ability I don't want people to forget how well he played as a 13 with Lockers injured, he was better at 13 that Lockers. He needs to be given the confidence by the coaching staff and played their and told he's the man for the job, go out there, link up with the 6 and 7 and become the best 13 going.
Lockers is a good SR and an OK 13, he can be the tackle machine with go forward in the SR, a back 3 with Lockers-tackle machine, Hock-SR with go forward, and Joel as a ball playing loose we have a good back 3. 3 Wiganers to boot.
My team for next week:
Richards Roberts Gleeson Carmont Ainscough Tomkins Smith Coley Tommy Davies (till O Carroll is fit) Lockers Hock Joel Tomkins ---------------- Feka, Prescott, Riddell Hansen
Look out for Farrell in the reserves I often watch them play and he's the one to watch, if Hock is injured he's the one the start, he has more go forward than Hansen or Bailey.
Tell Smith not to worry about pressure, just go out and play with flair and attacking style, get the ball out to the backs as much as possible.
Tell Coley he's the man, get out there and be aggrestive machine, the man who the others look up to, tell him he's the man, now go out and prove it.
Tell the forwards to fight and show some balls, be men and hit the line hard.
Tell Sam to demand the ball when he wants it, to work off the back of Smith and be a fast flowing second receiver.
Tell Pat to join the centres/wingers in attack when linking up, tell him to become a deep second lying reciever further back and off set off Sam giving Smith more options.
Tell the forwards to protect Smith in defensive and flatten anyone who dares go near their half backs.
Tell Joel to link up with this brother when he can and to stand opposite side of Smith to offer himself as a second receiver on the other side of the field.
Tell Tommy speed for dummy half is everything, race up to the ball and run the other team ragged with dummy runs and force the team to play fast with quick passes from dummy half.
Tell the fans to stick in there and how proud I am to be a Wiganer and feel proud when I see so many Wigners following the men in Cherry and While through anything, gonna keep showing the players how well we play our role.
Tell IL to give me the coaching job!
COME ON WIGAN!!
Bloody hell after all the rubbish you've put out... this is totally perfect imo. Just glad I didn't have to bother typing it.
The team did try in France but after 30 mins they were running on empty.
We do need to boost the team though and getting TL to 9 is long over due.
To get him there we should start with TL at 7 with Smith 6, then when Piggy is spelled TL goes to 9 with Sam T coming on off the bench.
No use criticising the halves. Halves are not going to do much if the pack gets steamrollered like ours did Monday night.
The problem is the pack, it needs sorting now!
Whether players are available to come in is doubtful but IL & BN should be looking around now to bolster our pack. With Goulding & Mossop going on loan since Gleeson's arrival it looks as though they may be freeing up salary cap space to bring in another player. Hopefully this time a prop!
My team v Celtic would be, Richards, Roberts, Gleeson, Carmont, (Pryce) Ainscough, Smith, Leuluai, Fielden, Riddell, Coley, Hock, Bailey, O'Loughlin.
Sam Tomkins, Paleaaesina, Hansen, Prescott.
GazzaPieman wrote:Richards Ainscough Carmont(if fit) Gleeson Phelps Tomkns Prescott Tommy(easy do 80mins) Coley O'loughlin Hock(if fit) Joel
Subs
Feka Bailey Hansen (Any prop from reserves!!!!!!!)
Roberts/Smith/Pryce to reserves ,
Fielden to go on a 'How to run forwards without falling over at the first hint of a defender' course (epic fail methinks)
Why? I think he's been improving.
And are we only playing with 16?
RICHARDS IS SUPERMAN!!!!
Wire_91 wrote:its your first final in about 8 years and now you ravin and rantin about it F**k off, and ill be going old trafford tomoz cheering on the saints and ill be writing on this forum givin you loads of shi* when your drying you eyes and the wire fan will be here handing out the tissues in the thousands, thats if you do take that many fans cause now it looks like its your fans who have jumped on the band wagon now your in a final, this time last year there was only 1000 people in the jjb and now its fillin up cause youve won the league hahaha proper true supporters you are
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