It was a risky post, risked upsetting lots of fans.
But there are positives with out squad, but I'm not slagging off Sam in the slightest. I think there is an element of sadness that at this stage alot of our hopes and dreams are resting on the shoulders of a young lad.
Not a Capt, not a seasoned halfback or a Sh!thouse prop, Sam will do us all proud, but he can't do it on this own.
As the team gets more desperate so does Hock because he is trying anything to lift the team and create something because he knows he is one of Wigan's few "go to" players. He is a world class player and one of the best second row forwards in super league and has one of the best offloads in the game. In a Saints or Leeds side he would be devastating. Although he has his moments of madness he is not overrated.
Andy Coley and Phil Bailey's contracts are up at the end of the year - and this gives us chance to get rid of some of the average players in our side along with Cameron Phelps, Tim Smith and Richie Mathers.
I honestly believe that for as long as Brian Noble is here Stuart Fielden will be here.
Harrison Hansen I would agree with. His defense is great but in attack he offers little. Although against Bradford he did run some good lines in attack. He needs to improve in time for when his contract runs out as he will come under pressure from Lee Mossop and Liam Farrell in the reserves.
Sean O'loughlin would not recieve half the amount of stick he does if he wasn't the Wigan captain. He does not have the attributes IMO to be a captain and because of the pressure of this responsibility he tries to do too much during games which leads to errors and silly plays. Without this pressure we could see a much better Sean O'loughlin. He is an international quality player IMO.
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Last Son of Wigan wrote:It was a risky post, risked upsetting lots of fans.
But there are positives with out squad, but I'm not slagging off Sam in the slightest. I think there is an element of sadness that at this stage alot of our hopes and dreams are resting on the shoulders of a young lad.
Not a Capt, not a seasoned halfback or a Sh!thouse prop, Sam will do us all proud, but he can't do it on this own.
Your right. Were lacking a leader big style. I rubbished it last season and said that it wasnt right, but looking back, had we been able to get wiki for this season he could have answered all our problems.....an enforcer prop with the capability to lead the team around the field....two of the main aspects we are severely lacking.....Yes it would have only been a short term fix, but whack a player like that into our current squad and we go from title pretenders to title challengers IMO
Last Son of Wigan wrote:I see a trend with a lot of the posts on this site, and the constant overrating of our players. And at the same time the slagging off the coach or management.
Lets look these two issues...
For the last 2yrs we've stated the want for an enforcer prop. But what or who did Wigan sign? Stu Fielden.
At the time the best prop in the league, if not the RL, and he's from the UK and in his prime, what a signing. But what has Mr Fielden produced? Very little.
I'm sick and tired of people praising him for basically the basics, he's an average prop in an average league. Why do you think our team is having problems? weak pack that can't bully their opposing pack around the field.
Hock-Very patchy. Moments of great play and moments of madness. Until he gets this sorted he's not as good people rate him as.
Hansen-over all average, great in defence, clueless in attack.
Lockers-Average to decent player. too much pressure on him, the club asks too much of him to be a loose and a capt. not good enough to carry so much on his shoulders.
Coley-Should be a good hardworking prop, but is far down the list of props in the league. No place at Wigan.
Sam Tomkins-Please lets be realistic with Sam. He has bags of talent and potential, but his praise on here is going to far. Anyone would think he's in Barretts league. No where near at this point. He will be good, but he didn't do anything against Leeds.
Roberts-For an experienced winger/fb he is poor under the high ball, Would like to see more from what so far has been an average winger.
Bailey-Average. Decent in defense but lets face it, anyone in SL should be.
This is not a total rant, more of a reality check.. On the otherhand
Tommy, Joel, Carmont, Ainscough look like they fit right in at SL level and haven't been completely overrated on here.
Just remember, this is a reason we have only won twice all season.
Without pulling your post apart Dave O Style most of the problems you state could and should be sorted out by our coaching department ,however our first team player don't seem to develope and improve year to year, with the same problems constantly rearing their heads be that slow starts , discipline , decision making and skills both in attack and defence .
We should be getting the the best from our current squad and we are not and if we were we would start to be consistent , maybe not world beaters but better than we are .
Gaz Hock has his qualities but this is exactly what the point is about.
How can he be world class when he has so many issues with his game? Offloads-can be tried at time when the pass isn't on or in a dodgy situation, result is a loss in possession.
For me a world class player has composure, something Gaz is lacking in his game when the going gets tough.
Last Son of Wigan wrote:Gaz Hock has his qualities but this is exactly what the point is about.
How can he be world class when he has so many issues with his game? Offloads-can be tried at time when the pass isn't on or in a dodgy situation, result is a loss in possession.
For me a world class player has composure, something Gaz is lacking in his game when the going gets tough.
BLOODY HELL.....someone else in wigan is actually switched on about hocks shortcomings!! exactly why hock is NOT a world class player
Joined: Mar 27 2006 Posts: 5799 Location: Coventry
andyed-wiganrl wrote::IDEA: BLOODY HELL.....someone else in wigan is actually switched on about hocks shortcomings!! exactly why hock is NOT a world class player
Gareth Hock is not overrated far from it.
He has had a great start to the season the his shortcomings which you mention like, offloading in silly situations has disappeared from his game in the past season IMO (apart from that brainfart on Friday night in our ingoal)
Leeds did well to contain Hock and they stopped him playing, making breaks and offloading. He kept trying and trying and came up with a try and one controversial disallowed try. Also Hock was still one of our better players on the night.
Hock is not world class and I was disappointed with his performance at the WC which was a big stage where I thought he could shine and show us what he can do. But in SL he is very good and is certainly not overrated.
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It is amazing how one week Gareth Hock is a superstar the next minute he is overrated. The Leeds game Gareth Hock threw one daft ball in a moment of madness but he was still one of our best players and was a marked man throughout the game. He tries things and they sometimes come off for you and he is world class and sometimes they don't and he lacks composure. Most of the time our players aren't anticipating an offload and so it looks daft when he does offload.
Hock is playing really well and for us to play the expansive opportunistic game we crave, we need players to show some flair and individuality. If we are not prepared for the odd knock on or balls up, we should settle for the single minded approach that bored us so much round 1, 2 and 3. We should not call him for one moment of madness we should realise that so far this season I believe he has been quite composed for us. Yes with such an expansive player with so much flair about them he will make mistakes and rash judgements but unless we wish to take a retained, static approach to the game then we should accept that he will make mistakes but will create more tries and opportunities to score than he will throw a daft pass.
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Last edited by cadoo on Sun Mar 15, 2009 8:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.
There was a defining moment in the Bradford game, a 30sec period which sums up his whole career.
He made a great break, ran right through the team showing a great step, good speed and strength-excellent, but then what happens next? he misses the pass and makes a mess of it.
When he has the composure to make the pass he'll be world class.
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BLOODY HELL.....someone else in wigan is actually switched on about hocks shortcomings!! 
