I could equally say the same to you.

Are you really talking about the same player here? I am on about Carl Ablett.

You know Carl Ablett who has 2 GF winners medals, same Carl Ablett who has played in two WCC with 1 winners medals.

In that same champion team he is holding down his place where ever asked to play. And you seriously suggest as silly that Hansen and Tomkins are better than him?

Yes if they were in the Leeds team they would be.

Ricky Bibey won two challenge cups - you can polish turd.

Ricky Bibey has two challenge cup medals too, does that make him a good player?

Tomkins and Hansen are better than him at second row clearly. He's gets so much criticism from Leeds supporters it's unreal.

Thats the point. They wouldn't get in the leeds team. They are hardly standing out in the turd you are prodcucing week in week out now.

If they cant stand out in your team, how are they going to do it in a championship team. Which incidentally Ablett is excelling in.

Rogues Gallery wrote:Have a look at this then. http://www.superleague.co.uk/statistics_player.php?hs1=2008&hp1=1135&hs2=2008&hp2=1212&stat=tries&season=2008 Leuluai comes nowhere near Feka in any facet of the game. Thats fine by me I just think we get a bit more use out of kylie, I would definitely have Feka at Leeds though.

Rogues Gallery wrote:Have a look at this then. http://www.superleague.co.uk/statistics_player.php?hs1=2008&hp1=1135&hs2=2008&hp2=1212&stat=tries&season=2008 Leuluai comes nowhere near Feka in any facet of the game. Thats fine by me I just think we get a bit more use out of kylie, I would definitely have Feka at Leeds though.

Hansen - top tackler in SUPER LEAGUE last year

Tomkins - young player of the year at wigan and something like 3rd in super league

How is that not standing out

He doesn't get so much criticism at all. Where you getting that from?

There is difference of opinion with supporters as to whether he should be filling in at centre or we should have recruited a specialist.

Nobody is debating his place in the team. He is a backrower playing out of position sometimes. When in the backrow he excells. He excells to a far greater degree than your backrowers.

Which is why in response to the other poster whith the cr@ppy statistics. Hansen might well have been a high tackler last season. But you were doing a hell of a lot of defending for a start unlike championship sides. Plus Ablett played most of last year in the centres covering, like the good pro he is.

Tony Smith and Brian Mclennan disagree but what would they know about Super League.

ahhh here we go!! ablett is the latest to get stick from the pie's.

ask leeds fans who watch him week in week out about what we think about him. ablett is cracking and a great squad member! he's not slow, he can pass, he's tough and is very fit, but most of all he is an awesome defender.

whats happening here with ablett is what happend to jjb as few years back. other teams fans(including the usual suspects on here) said jjb wasnt nowt special and was only a winner from been in a good team. all i can say on ablett is watch this space, in a few more seasons and he will be up to jjb standered.

So you've given up on the hock and tomkins fight and now your argument is basically what im saying - Ablett is playing in a champion side, he looks good because of the players around him. If hansen, hock or tomkins played in that side they would look a hell of a lot better than him.