Post subject: Re: "who knows what the next 2 or 3 years has in store ?"
Posted: Thu Dec 03, 2009 1:30 pm
Mild Rover
Moderator
Joined: Jun 01 2007 Posts: 12664 Location: Leicestershire.
berrigans bitch wrote:I agree, however I believe the problem may be that although he runs a successful business, he appears not to be as successful with running the club, I believe this is because he is a fan and it gets personal who knows, however whilst this is happening I am not sure he will get the backing he wants, I believe it would be beneficial for the club to put in some-one who will approach it as a business venture, not be interested in fc and stay focused on their own club without petty rivalry, until this happens I am afraid the problems will carry on and investment will not be so forth coming.
Some interesting points. However, I think to date NH has done a spectacularly successful job of running the club - as a club, if not a business. Would we rather be breaking even each year in the Championship, with no prospect of ever getting a SL licence or be where Rovers are today, warts and all? I believe the B&W assessments of NH are made because they are fans and it gets personal - who knows?
If it had been treated as a purely business venture, Rovers would never have got a SL license. Also moving forward, would it not appear more incongruous for a profitable business venture to be receiving public money in such straitened times, rather than supporting an important community asset?
Tbh, I don't think sports clubs should benefit from public support. But they do and I don't see why Hull KR shouldn't ask for a slice of the pie. Though it might appear to be petty rivalry, reminding people of the support Hull FC have received is a useful political tool. Just speculating, but the £300k that was secured from the for the east stand extension may not have been won by somebody uninterested in the doings of Hull FC - there is certainly a competition for resources. It is both useful and, sadly, easy for NH to present Rovers (and by implication therefore, East Hull) as having had the rough end of things in recent years.
Post subject: Re: "who knows what the next 2 or 3 years has in store ?"
Posted: Thu Dec 03, 2009 1:56 pm
Tarquin Fuego
Club Owner
Joined: Feb 03 2004 Posts: 3738 Location: United Kingdom
However, I think to date NH has done a spectacularly successful job of running the club - as a club, if not a business.
I could have done that as well by going £450,000 over budget for 3 years with no real assets to secure the debt against. How can you say he has done a good job ????? Team has done well but what has that got to do with a loss of £450,000 each year. Look at Widnes
Post subject: Re: "who knows what the next 2 or 3 years has in store ?"
Posted: Thu Dec 03, 2009 2:28 pm
Vicenzo
Club Coach
Joined: Jul 31 2005 Posts: 1802
Nobeerineasthull wrote:The flaw in your argument is that the directors are also the shareholders i.e. the owners of the club.
All business owners have to be ready to put money into their business when its needed.
If the director/shareholders want their money back, the business can repay them (as and when it can afford it) or they can sell it to someone else and get their money back that way.
There is no flaw in the argument. The directors of Hull SL are now after a few years having their loans (which they took out of the club in the first place) repaid over a period of time. Hudgell seems to be pointing out that the club has to stand on its own as does every sports club. It will be interesting to see if there is any "debt repayment" following SL's disatrous season just passed...I doubt it!
p.s.
The suggestion that the director/shareholders would simply demand their loans back and wind up the club in order to get it is fanciful as it would render their shares worthless.
Post subject: Re: "who knows what the next 2 or 3 years has in store ?"
Posted: Thu Dec 03, 2009 2:45 pm
Bet Lynch
Club Coach
Joined: Aug 04 2008 Posts: 16983
Mild Rover wrote:Some interesting points. However, I think to date NH has done a spectacularly successful job of running the club - as a club, if not a business. Would we rather be breaking even each year in the Championship, with no prospect of ever getting a SL licence or be where Rovers are today, warts and all? I believe the B&W assessments of NH are made because they are fans and it gets personal - who knows? If it had been treated as a purely business venture, Rovers would never have got a SL license. Also moving forward, would it not appear more incongruous for a profitable business venture to be receiving public money in such straitened times, rather than supporting an important community asset? Tbh, I don't think sports clubs should benefit from public support. But they do and I don't see why Hull KR shouldn't ask for a slice of the pie. Though it might appear to be petty rivalry, reminding people of the support Hull FC have received is a useful political tool. Just speculating, but the £300k that was secured from the for the east stand extension may not have been won by somebody uninterested in the doings of Hull FC - there is certainly a competition for resources. It is both useful and, sadly, easy for NH to present Rovers (and by implication therefore, East Hull) as having had the rough end of things in recent years.
That is the crux, to survive in top flight it has to be viewed as a business in order to survive, he may be great for the fans mixing in the east stand, on occasions passing remarks about his rivals (fc), kr fans love all this, nice and cosy..however he is losing half a million a year!! would you not sooner have more financial stability some-one who has no interest in us and is only focused on your club,or are you happy Hudge who loves to get one over his rivals and imo overspends in his quest to do this, Cooke, Dobson
Post subject: Re: "who knows what the next 2 or 3 years has in store ?"
Posted: Thu Dec 03, 2009 2:45 pm
Mild Rover
Moderator
Joined: Jun 01 2007 Posts: 12664 Location: Leicestershire.
Tarquin Fuego wrote:I could have done that as well by going £450,000 over budget for 3 years with no real assets to secure the debt against. How can you say he has done a good job ????? Team has done well but what has that got to do with a loss of £450,000 each year. Look at Widnes
You're assuming an investment budget of £0. And unless you are wealthy (ie would be willing and able to spend £1.35 million over 3 years), no you couldn't. On the other hand, I'm pretty confident that given a council-built state of the art stadium and a team that had just been to Old Trafford, that I could have matched the performance of Hull board over the same 3 year period.
I do look at Widnes - they are a very good comparator. They were rescued from administration by a wealthy benefactor in 2007. They have have a lovely, but rarely very full, stadium that was built in partnership with Halton Borough Council, where they host their Championship and NRC fixtures. All of which reflects rather well on the Stewardship of NH, IMO.
The team has done well and that has been crucial making the club more than mere SL makeweights. In fact many clubs use the performance of their team as an important metric of success.
You ask how I can say he has done a good job. Well look at where the club were when he started and look where they are now. I'm hardly a lone voice in the wilderness on this:
Andy Wilson in July 2009 wrote:First, huge credit where it is due to Hull Kingston Rovers, starting from their chairman Neil Hudgell and Justin Morgan, the coach he appointed in that summer of 2005. Hudgell, a local solicitor and passionate Rovers fan, started with ambition and vision, and had the drive and intelligence to turn unlikely dreams into reality.
Post subject: Re: "who knows what the next 2 or 3 years has in store ?"
Posted: Thu Dec 03, 2009 2:50 pm
Bet Lynch
Club Coach
Joined: Aug 04 2008 Posts: 16983
Mild Rover wrote:You're assuming an investment budget of £0. And unless you are wealthy (ie would be willing and able to spend £1.35 million over 3 years), no you couldn't. On the other hand, I'm pretty confident that given a council-built state of the art stadium and a team that had just been to Old Trafford, that I could have matched the performance of Hull board over the same 3 year period.
I do look at Widnes - they are a very good comparator. They were rescued from administration by a wealthy benefactor in 2007. They have have a lovely, but rarely very full, stadium that was built in partnership with Halton Borough Council, where they host their Championship and NRC fixtures. All of which reflects rather well on the Stewardship of NH, IMO.
The team has done well and that has been crucial making the club more than mere SL makeweights. In fact many clubs use the performance of their team as an important metric of success.
You ask how I can say he has done a good job. Well look at where the club were when he started and look where they are now. I'm hardly a lone voice in the wilderness on this:
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 208 guests
You cannot post new topics in this forum You cannot reply to topics in this forum You cannot edit your posts in this forum You cannot delete your posts in this forum You cannot post attachments in this forum