Joined: Sep 14 2009 Posts: 1606 Location: on route to old trafford via wembley
Bombed Out wrote:How many seasons do we just press the reset button though? It's not about sock washing but just sick of the same old failings. Something has to give surely? I do want a successful season and a competitive team but as yet this season is just a continuation of what has gone on before.
Our second row partnership of Ma'u and Jones have played once together so far, Leeds away. Savelio, who started like an house on fire, has missed the last 3 games. Satae has missed two of the five, Kelly has only played once. Faraimo has missed 3 of the 5 games, Ratu has only played two and half games, Swift only 2 games. Bowden, Ellis, Houghton and Carlos have all missed a game each, and Connor has missed half a game. And we were very close to being 3 wins from 5 during a tough run of fixtures. And we're in the plus for points difference. You don't need to panic just yet, we're not going as badly as it seems.
giddyupoldfella wrote:Our second row partnership of Ma'u and Jones have played once together so far, Leeds away. Savelio, who started like an house on fire, has missed the last 3 games. Satae has missed two of the five, Kelly has only played once. Faraimo has missed 3 of the 5 games, Ratu has only played two and half games, Swift only 2 games. Bowden, Ellis and Carlos have all missed a game each, and Connor has missed half a game. And we were very close to being 3 wins from 5 during a tough run of fixtures. And we're in the plus for points difference. You don't need to panic just yet, we're not going as badly as it seems.
So what you're saying is then that unless we have our starting 13 on the field to implement our 1 and only tactic we're going to struggle. I think that is evident I appreciate you're a glass half full fan but your reasoning is flawed as we wouldn't know how we would have fared regardless and 3 of those mentioned are not starting 13. Even with said players back it would not change our slow ptb, slow sliding defence, inability to break the opposition line and the fact our defensive line is static, giving an easy 10 metres.
All scenerios are ifs buts or maybes I appreciate that but I'm looking rather at our style of play and not making excuses for players missing. Saints, Wigan players slot in systems don't change. Us, players missing, system fails.
Joined: Sep 14 2009 Posts: 1606 Location: on route to old trafford via wembley
Bombed Out wrote:So what you're saying is then that unless we have our starting 13 on the field to implement our 1 and only tactic we're going to struggle. I think that is evident I appreciate you're a glass half full fan but your reasoning is flawed as we wouldn't know how we would have fared regardless and 3 of those mentioned are not starting 13. Even with said players back it would not change our slow ptb, slow sliding defence, inability to break the opposition line and the fact our defensive line is static, giving an easy 10 metres.
All scenerios are ifs buts or maybes I appreciate that but I'm looking rather at our style of play and not making excuses for players missing. Saints, Wigan players slot in systems don't change. Us, players missing, system fails.
Our style of play is OK, we score some of the most exciting tries in the league, I'd be surprised if any team scores more tries from in their own half, than us.
I'm not saying we need our best 17 out there all the time, but it's the continuty of the team that gets picked from game to game. At the moment, we've got a different 1-17 every game. It's a tough ask to build momentum and confidence when that's happening.
I'm not an advocate of sacking Radford. I agree that for 2 seasons our performances have not been acceptable, with some massive defeats and a record equalling run of defeats. It doesn't read well.
However, Pearson has listened to Radfords plan, offloaded heavily and replaced with what looks like some great new recruits. So having been given the baton, Radford has to be given the chance to run with it. The first game showed that this team can play, and yet despite a narrow win against a good Rovers, the few injuries that we've suffered seem to really rock us, which questions our strength in depth I suppose, particularly when key men are out. The performance against Catalans is the worrying one for me, in that we had the game won with 20mins to go. So Radfords game plan can work and we were good for 60 mins and looked like we'd go on to score more points. The massive issue for me is more about the mental strength of the squad as a whole. Its an absolutely critical factor. Thinking a game is won before it actually is has become a habit at Hull FC. Whereas champion teams in that position squeeze the foot on the throat even harder.
But because teams know we are weak mentally, teams feel they are never beaten with Hull FC. They always feel they can come back at us. We give them that belief because ours is so weak, time after time. Its real and present. Its becoming our trademark.
So, because it is clearly a collective problem the responsibility ultimately is Radfords to eradicate this softness that is part of our team make-up. If he can instil a mental strength, where the team think and behave as one, often lead by a captains inspiration and his ability to demand bodies are on the line, then we can really do something. Because I do believe we have the talent to still have a great season.
But there has to be a huge mindset change, there has to be a change of captain, there has to be a feeling of oneness on the pitch and a willingness to defend every gain line with total controlled ferocity.
If we can do that, because Radfords is able to instil that missing, never-say-die killer instinct into his team then we can quickly recreate our early optimism. But if he can't I would give him 10 matches, and if he cant rectify our quite pathetic mental strength that incredibly just cannot last for 80 mins. he'll be gone.
Joined: Sep 14 2009 Posts: 1606 Location: on route to old trafford via wembley
Uppo58 wrote:I'm not an advocate of sacking Radford. I agree that for 2 seasons our performances have not been acceptable, with some massive defeats and a record equalling run of defeats. It doesn't read well.
However, Pearson has listened to Radfords plan, offloaded heavily and replaced with what looks like some great new recruits. So having been given the baton, Radford has to be given the chance to run with it. The first game showed that this team can play, and yet despite a narrow win against a good Rovers, the few injuries that we've suffered seem to really rock us, which questions our strength in depth I suppose, particularly when key men are out. The performance against Catalans is the worrying one for me, in that we had the game won with 20mins to go. So Radfords game plan can work and we were good for 60 mins and looked like we'd go on to score more points. The massive issue for me is more about the mental strength of the squad as a whole. Its an absolutely critical factor. Thinking a game is won before it actually is has become a habit at Hull FC. Whereas champion teams in that position squeeze the foot on the throat even harder.
But because teams know we are weak mentally, teams feel they are never beaten with Hull FC. They always feel they can come back at us. We give them that belief because ours is so weak, time after time. Its real and present. Its becoming our trademark.
So, because it is clearly a collective problem the responsibility ultimately is Radfords to eradicate this softness that is part of our team make-up. If he can instil a mental strength, where the team think and behave as one, often lead by a captains inspiration and his ability to demand bodies are on the line, then we can really do something. Because I do believe we have the talent to still have a great season.
But there has to be a huge mindset change, there has to be a change of captain, there has to be a feeling of oneness on the pitch and a willingness to defend every gain line with total controlled ferocity.
If we can do that, because Radfords is able to instil that missing, never-say-die killer instinct into his team then we can quickly recreate our early optimism. But if he can't I would give him 10 matches, and if he cant rectify our quite pathetic mental strength that incredibly just cannot last for 80 mins. he'll be gone.
The Connor injury, scuppered Radders game plan against Cats. He was planning on only playing Kelly for an hour or so, because it was his first game and bring Carlos on when Kelly's legs tired. What with Ma'u only just returning from injury, and Fonua and Carlos still not 100%, our right edge did tire late in the game, and Tomkins took advantage of that. But those players will be better off for the game under their belts.
Last edited by giddyupoldfella on Tue Mar 03, 2020 1:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Joined: Mar 21 2017 Posts: 159 Location: Back to God's own country!
Uppo58 wrote:I'm not an advocate of sacking Radford. I agree that for 2 seasons our performances have not been acceptable, with some massive defeats and a record equalling run of defeats. It doesn't read well.
However, Pearson has listened to Radfords plan, offloaded heavily and replaced with what looks like some great new recruits. So having been given the baton, Radford has to be given the chance to run with it. The first game showed that this team can play, and yet despite a narrow win against a good Rovers, the few injuries that we've suffered seem to really rock us, which questions our strength in depth I suppose, particularly when key men are out. The performance against Catalans is the worrying one for me, in that we had the game won with 20mins to go. So Radfords game plan can work and we were good for 60 mins and looked like we'd go on to score more points. The massive issue for me is more about the mental strength of the squad as a whole. Its an absolutely critical factor. Thinking a game is won before it actually is has become a habit at Hull FC. Whereas champion teams in that position squeeze the foot on the throat even harder.
But because teams know we are weak mentally, teams feel they are never beaten with Hull FC. They always feel they can come back at us. We give them that belief because ours is so weak, time after time. Its real and present. Its becoming our trademark.
So, because it is clearly a collective problem the responsibility ultimately is Radfords to eradicate this softness that is part of our team make-up. If he can instil a mental strength, where the team think and behave as one, often lead by a captains inspiration and his ability to demand bodies are on the line, then we can really do something. Because I do believe we have the talent to still have a great season.
But there has to be a huge mindset change, there has to be a change of captain, there has to be a feeling of oneness on the pitch and a willingness to defend every gain line with total controlled ferocity.
If we can do that, because Radfords is able to instil that missing, never-say-die killer instinct into his team then we can quickly recreate our early optimism. But if he can't I would give him 10 matches, and if he cant rectify our quite pathetic mental strength that incredibly just cannot last for 80 mins. he'll be gone.
Well said. I think this is absolutely spot on.
"If the human brain were so simple that we could understand it, we would be so simple that we couldn't." - Emerson M. Pugh
Uppo58 wrote:I'm not an advocate of sacking Radford. I agree that for 2 seasons our performances have not been acceptable, with some massive defeats and a record equalling run of defeats. It doesn't read well.
However, Pearson has listened to Radfords plan, offloaded heavily and replaced with what looks like some great new recruits. So having been given the baton, Radford has to be given the chance to run with it. The first game showed that this team can play, and yet despite a narrow win against a good Rovers, the few injuries that we've suffered seem to really rock us, which questions our strength in depth I suppose, particularly when key men are out. The performance against Catalans is the worrying one for me, in that we had the game won with 20mins to go. So Radfords game plan can work and we were good for 60 mins and looked like we'd go on to score more points. The massive issue for me is more about the mental strength of the squad as a whole. Its an absolutely critical factor. Thinking a game is won before it actually is has become a habit at Hull FC. Whereas champion teams in that position squeeze the foot on the throat even harder.
But because teams know we are weak mentally, teams feel they are never beaten with Hull FC. They always feel they can come back at us. We give them that belief because ours is so weak, time after time. Its real and present. Its becoming our trademark.
So, because it is clearly a collective problem the responsibility ultimately is Radfords to eradicate this softness that is part of our team make-up. If he can instil a mental strength, where the team think and behave as one, often lead by a captains inspiration and his ability to demand bodies are on the line, then we can really do something. Because I do believe we have the talent to still have a great season.
But there has to be a huge mindset change, there has to be a change of captain, there has to be a feeling of oneness on the pitch and a willingness to defend every gain line with total controlled ferocity.
If we can do that, because Radfords is able to instil that missing, never-say-die killer instinct into his team then we can quickly recreate our early optimism. But if he can't I would give him 10 matches, and if he cant rectify our quite pathetic mental strength that incredibly just cannot last for 80 mins. he'll be gone.
once a black and white always a black and white COYH
giddyupoldfella wrote:The Connor injury, scuppered Radders game plan against Cats. He was planning on only playing Kelly for an hour or so, because it was his first game and bring Carlos on when Kelly's legs tired. What with Ma'u only just returning from injury, and Fonua and Carlos still not 100%, our right edge did tire late in the game, and Tomkins took advantage of that. But those players will be better off for the game under their belts.
How do you know what Lee's tactics were? (genuine question)
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