Joined: Jan 22 2018 Posts: 2807 Location: Tomorrowland
PopTart wrote:I think Max would have to have a worldy of a season in SL to displace Welsby.
And although he is doing amazing and will undoubtedly break records, he isn't playing at the same level that those records were set.
I think Welsby is a good player, but I don`t subscribe to this idea that he is a world beater, but that`s just me. I saw Wells saying a couple of months back that he thought he was the best fullback in world rugby, which is beyond ludicrous for me.
I have have often thought, I wonder if you would have put Max in the sides that Welsby has come through playing in, how he would look, I`m not sure there would be a great deal of difference in how good a player he would look.
Joined: Feb 11 2011 Posts: 2125 Location: Wakefield
Trojan Horse wrote:Full backs don’t hit their best until 29-33 or so. Players like Coote. 27 is young for a full back and his best years are now coming up where all that experience can be utilised.
I struggle to see what English full back other than Max there will be competition wise.
Wellby gets the nod with his running game mainly but in terms of full back play rather than individualism I’d say Max is the better player. A player who can create space and pass like Jowitt would go very well on the international stage imho. Whether he gets the chance we will see I guess.
There’s very little competition in that position to be honest and it wouldn’t take much for Jowitt to get into the set up over next few years if he keeps on as he is.
I mean when you’ve got some of the players listed getting a call up like this week it’s certainly possible.
Don’t agree with Fb’s hit their prime late 20’s early 30, you’ve either got it or you haven’t…. the NRL provides perfect examples of that. England’s Fb for the last decade consistently has been Tomkins and was way better earlier than latter in his career. I hope Max gets a call up, I really do but Wane will have his opinion on him and unfortunately that’s what matters.
Joined: Feb 11 2011 Posts: 2125 Location: Wakefield
homme vaste wrote:I think Welsby is a good player, but I don`t subscribe to this idea that he is a world beater, but that`s just me. I saw Wells saying a couple of months back that he thought he was the best fullback in world rugby, which is beyond ludicrous for me.
I have have often thought, I wonder if you would have put Max in the sides that Welsby has come through playing in, how he would look, I`m not sure there would be a great deal of difference in how good a player he would look.
To describe Welsby as the best FB in the world is just ridiculous. He should have took a contract down under to see if he could match it, like Dodd has. I can genuinely think of at least 8 FB’s in the NRL that are head and shoulders better than him. What lets Max down massively is his 1 on 1 defence. I genuinely think he has the attacking flair of a quality FB, but his defence at times is lacking for a top quality FB. Just my opinion of course.
Pat Bateman wrote:To describe Welsby as the best FB in the world is just ridiculous. He should have took a contract down under to see if he could match it, like Dodd has. I can genuinely think of at least 8 FB’s in the NRL that are head and shoulders better than him. What lets Max down massively is his 1 on 1 defence. I genuinely think he has the attacking flair of a quality FB, but his defence at times is lacking for a top quality FB. Just my opinion of course.
That’s Jowitts only part of his game that lets him down slightly. However he does pull out the occasional try saver on the line too.
Every other part of his full back play is bob on.
Who other than Welsby in SL would you swap him with as a player elegible for England? None or hardly any for me.
His best years are ahead of him just like Tomkins, Wellens, Coote etc over here in the UK. A post further up mentions younger full backs in NRL but they have a lot of young talent in that position unlike the superleague where our fullbacks tend to show best form later on.
Joined: Oct 26 2006 Posts: 13821 Location: No bowl, stick, STICK!
All I want is for him to be the best he can be for Trintiy. To be honest I couldn't care less whether he gets representative honours or not. He's playing against part time players so the enthusiasm needs to be curbed somewhat, he's not as good as Welsby who is also younger.
Joined: Oct 04 2008 Posts: 21042 Location: wakefield
Trojan Horse wrote:That’s Jowitts only part of his game that lets him down slightly. However he does pull out the occasional try saver on the line too.
Every other part of his full back play is bob on.
Who other than Welsby in SL would you swap him with as a player elegible for England? None or hardly any for me.
His best years are ahead of him just like Tomkins, Wellens, Coote etc over here in the UK. A post further up mentions younger full backs in NRL but they have a lot of young talent in that position unlike the superleague where our fullbacks tend to show best form later on.
I don't get the logic of the players you mention. They were all stars when they were younger. They didn't get better when they were older they just played well and adapted their game when they were older.
A dog is not considered a good dog because he is a good barker. A man is not considered a good man because he is a good talker - Buddha
PopTart wrote:I don't get the logic of the players you mention. They were all stars when they were younger. They didn't get better when they were older they just played well and adapted their game when they were older.
But their full back play did get better as they got older imo. Their all round play was much improved as a full back especially in organising other players around them and becoming ball players rather than flair players. Take Tomkins, young lad who was good but mainly because of his step and ability to glide through the gaps rather than create space and opportunity for others. He naturally developed this over his career.
You don’t have to agree with me. I’m not precious at all but I think there could be a chance over the next few years.
Someone posted above about they care about his form for Trinity. That goes without saying and if he goes onto be a good club man I’ll be happy with that.
Max reminds me a lot of Richie Mathers. His one on one defence can sometimes let him down but when he joins the attacking line he's like a good third half-back.
"Back home we got a taxidermy man. He gonna have a heart attack when he see what I brung him."
Joined: Feb 11 2011 Posts: 2125 Location: Wakefield
Trojan Horse wrote:That’s Jowitts only part of his game that lets him down slightly. However he does pull out the occasional try saver on the line too.
Every other part of his full back play is bob on.
Who other than Welsby in SL would you swap him with as a player elegible for England? None or hardly any for me.
His best years are ahead of him just like Tomkins, Wellens, Coote etc over here in the UK. A post further up mentions younger full backs in NRL but they have a lot of young talent in that position unlike the superleague where our fullbacks tend to show best form later on.
As a whole we are struggling for quality fullbacks, Welsby as a whole is the best we have. There’s Thewlis at Wire that’s played there abit and Will Pryce at the knights (making debut this weekend). If Jowitt was to toss his hat in the ring it would be next year with hopefully the best quality side he’ll of ever been in. His defence doesn’t let him down slightly it’ll let him down massively at international level. For me the best fullback in the world is Dylan Edward’s, his defence is equally as good as his attack, he’s just quality.
Joined: Oct 04 2008 Posts: 21042 Location: wakefield
Trojan Horse wrote:But their full back play did get better as they got older imo. Their all round play was much improved as a full back especially in organising other players around them and becoming ball players rather than flair players. Take Tomkins, young lad who was good but mainly because of his step and ability to glide through the gaps rather than create space and opportunity for others. He naturally developed this over his career.
You don’t have to agree with me. I’m not precious at all but I think there could be a chance over the next few years.
Someone posted above about they care about his form for Trinity. That goes without saying and if he goes onto be a good club man I’ll be happy with that.
I agree he's good, and I also agree he'll get better, I'm just not as confident as you that he'll be playing for England.
A dog is not considered a good dog because he is a good barker. A man is not considered a good man because he is a good talker - Buddha
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