Getting humped by 43 points by NZ on home turf with the likes of Scott Naylor in the centres, Wellens on the wing (speed demon!), Deacon at stand off, Tony Smith at hooker, Harvey Howard propping and, wait for it, Andy Hay and Darren Fleary on the bench.
That team would get obliterated by the best of 2009. Having said that, I agree that there's been some very poor games this year.
On the other hand, I think that some of the kids getting games in SL over the last few years are WAAAAAAY better than those we were seeing 8/9 years ago.
Since when did an internationl game have anything to do with Superleague standards?
Im talking about the players walking around SL back then. Wigan for instance.....
Andy Farrell, Steve Renouf, Kris Rads, Adrian Lam, Jason Robinson, Gary Connolly etc etc. None of our current players are better than any of those named and all would get in every current SL team
Getting humped by 43 points by NZ on home turf with the likes of Scott Naylor in the centres, Wellens on the wing (speed demon!), Deacon at stand off, Tony Smith at hooker, Harvey Howard propping and, wait for it, Andy Hay and Darren Fleary on the bench.
That team would get obliterated by the best of 2009. Having said that, I agree that there's been some very poor games this year.
On the other hand, I think that some of the kids getting games in SL over the last few years are WAAAAAAY better than those we were seeing 8/9 years ago.
Since when did an internationl game have anything to do with Superleague standards?
Im talking about the players walking around SL back then. Wigan for instance.....
Andy Farrell, Steve Renouf, Kris Rads, Adrian Lam, Jason Robinson, Gary Connolly etc etc. None of our current players are better than any of those named and all would get in every current SL team
ANCIENT & LOYAL UPON MY CHEST
Ancient and loyal, upon my chest they are men of wigans best a team that plaaayed, the wigan way and won the championship in may
jim sullivan, he was the king brian mctigue and johnny ring a team that plaaayed the wigan way and won the championship in may
when eric ashton was alive and billy boston by his side with dave bolton and billy blan oh what a time to be a fan
in 85, at wem-ber-ly john ferguson and brett kenny a team that plaaayed the wigan way and won the challenge cup in may
in 95 we won them all tuigamala, faz and paul a team that played the wigan way and won the championship in may
Joined: Sep 26 2002 Posts: 11377 Location: Much too far South
Meyt N Prater Pie wrote:Since when did an internationl game have anything to do with Superleague standards?
Im talking about the players walking around SL back then. Wigan for instance.....
Andy Farrell, Steve Renouf, Kris Rads, Adrian Lam, Jason Robinson, Gary Connolly etc etc. None of our current players are better than any of those named and all would get in every current SL team
I see your point, but then the decline of Wigan isn't a barometer for SL.
The 2000 Wigan team, including the likes of Robinson, Dallas, Renouf, Radlinski, O'Connor, Newton, Cowie, Cassidy, Betts and Farrell lost in the Grand Final to a Saints team including Steve Hall, Julian O'Neill, Tim Jonkers, John Stankevitch and Scott Barrow.
I would certainly bet on the 2009 Saints beating the 2000 Saints comfortably and we didn't even win it last year.
The quality over Easter has been poor - but then, couldn't we have guessed that playing 3 games in a week?
Thought both Wigan and Saints played well Maunday Thursday.
Wigan struggled like hell in Catalan four days later. I honestly don't know of any club that could have gone to Catalans and won last Monday.
If the Hull clubs had played Thursday I think they'd have lost by more than 16 points in France.
Saints have come away from Perpignan well beaten in the past.
It's hard enough V Catalans with an eight day turnround never mind four.
As for SL there is a decline and that is evident.
Isn't the strength of your domestic league gauged by the performances and results of the International squad?
The game needs a top down overhaul.
The RFL are truly awful proved by their "review" of the World Cup. They have abdicated their responsibility.
We also need a real look at the role of the Super League clubs themselves and their rule making. It is they who are taking the game backwards as they think of nothing but their own club's self interest. That's why the game as a whole is suffering and going nowhere.
FearTheVee wrote:I see your point, but then the decline of Wigan isn't a barometer for SL.
The 2000 Wigan team, including the likes of Robinson, Dallas, Renouf, Radlinski, O'Connor, Newton, Cowie, Cassidy, Betts and Farrell lost in the Grand Final to a Saints team including Steve Hall, Julian O'Neill, Tim Jonkers, John Stankevitch and Scott Barrow.
I would certainly bet on the 2009 Saints beating the 2000 Saints comfortably and we didn't even win it last year.
The quality over Easter has been poor - but then, couldn't we have guessed that playing 3 games in a week?
3 games in a week and poor quality? pah........try 11 games in 34 days,.......10 wins and a draw.
1991
Sun 10 Mar Challenge Cup QF: Bradford Home Won 32-2
Wed 13 Mar Hull Home Won 34-12
Sun 17 Mar Rochdale Hornets Away Won 44-16
Sat 23 Mar Challenge Cup Semi Final: Oldham Bolton Won 30-16
Tue 26 Mar Warrington Away Won 26-8
Fri 29 Mar Featherstone Rovers Away Won 24-16
Mon 1 April Oldham Away Won 10-4
Thu 4 April St Helens Home Won 28-14
Sun 7 April Castleford Home Won 24-4
Tue 9 April Widnes Home Won 26-6
Thu 11 April Bradford Northern Home Draw 18-18
Sat 13 April Leeds Away Won 20-8 To win the Championship
WIGAN RLFC - SL ERA
WORLD CLUB CHAMPIONS 2017 & 2024
SUPER LEAGUE CHAMPIONS 1998, 2010, 2013, 2016, 2018, 2023 & 2024
CHALLENGE CUP FINAL WINNERS 2002, 2011, 2013, 2022 & 2024
LEAGUE LEADERS CHAMPIONS 2010, 2012, 2020, 2023 & 2024
ACADEMY GRAND FINAL WINNERS 2008, 2009, 2010, 2011, 2013, 2014, 2015, 2017, 2018, 2019 & 2024
WOMEN’S GRAND FINAL WINNERS 2018
BEST SUPPORTED CLUB OF THE YEAR 2010, 2011, 2012 & 2024
Joined: Sep 26 2002 Posts: 11377 Location: Much too far South
MattyB wrote:3 games in a week and poor quality? pah........try 11 games in 34 days,.......10 wins and a draw.
1991
Sun 10 Mar Challenge Cup QF: Bradford Home Won 32-2 Wed 13 Mar Hull Home Won 34-12 Sun 17 Mar Rochdale Hornets Away Won 44-16 Sat 23 Mar Challenge Cup Semi Final: Oldham Bolton Won 30-16 Tue 26 Mar Warrington Away Won 26-8 Fri 29 Mar Featherstone Rovers Away Won 24-16 Mon 1 April Oldham Away Won 10-4 Thu 4 April St Helens Home Won 28-14 Sun 7 April Castleford Home Won 24-4 Tue 9 April Widnes Home Won 26-6 Thu 11 April Bradford Northern Home Draw 18-18 Sat 13 April Leeds Away Won 20-8 To win the Championship
Getting humped by 43 points by NZ on home turf with the likes of Scott Naylor in the centres, Wellens on the wing (speed demon!), Deacon at stand off, Tony Smith at hooker, Harvey Howard propping and, wait for it, Andy Hay and Darren Fleary on the bench.
That team would get obliterated by the best of 2009. Having said that, I agree that there's been some very poor games this year.
On the other hand, I think that some of the kids getting games in SL over the last few years are WAAAAAAY better than those we were seeing 8/9 years ago.
I always use this example but compare the line ups in this game of 2000 with the current line ups of wigan and bratfut for example to see how far the standard of SL has fallen due to the CC!!
The SL used to have approximately 5/6 top class teams who could match it with the best and with the NRL teams. Now the CC means each team can have no more than 2-3 WC / good players while the rest of each team are made up of mediocre poor to average players.
The result....yes a more competative league, but now in terms of the SL product the only top game that serves up any fayre is Saints V Leeds (probably due to the fact they have both circumvented the cap by using ofshore methods). The top games in SL used to be class matches, where skill, flare, fast running etc. came in droves. Any match between any two teams out of Bratfut, Wigan, Stains, Leeds, Wire, Hull etc. could almost always be guarenteed to be a classic.......Now there often pathetic games, most trys coming from errors of the less competent players, and often blow out scores to whichever one of the two teams is less 5h1t!! Look at wire v bratfut for a perfect example!!
Going back to that game I counted a total 16/17 WC players in both those line ups...compare that now between the two teams and your looking at 2/3 max!!
Yes more competitive the SL is, yet it has lost all its intensity and become a mediocre competition IMO. Those matches between the top 6 used to almost rival the intensity of the NRL....now the SL is little more intense than NL1. This years 4 nations will be even more embaressing as a result IMO!
The whole idea of the salary cap when it came in was supposed to stop teams going bust and also to improve the competition. What the CC has done though is dilute the competition massively.
What should have been done was to encourage the lesser teams to invest in acadamys, and increase their support in order to produce players of a better standard to match wigan, leeds, saints, bradford etc. and reinvest surplus monies in producing better talent, thus making the league rival the NRL for intesity and competitiveness.
What the RFL did in their infinate wisdom is rather than building from the bottom, they artificially stopped the top teams from getting stronger, and held them back to the levels of the lower clubs. THe result, a competitive but poor league - the spectacle has suffered, and with the CC in place not only is the standard of the league and players in decline, there is no incentive for any club to improve the situation, as you can compete in our poor shortsighted league on crowds of 4k and without any decent academy infrastructure, as teams like Harlequins / Huddersfield /Celtic and Wakefield are testiment to!!!
I worry for SL as I honestly think the competition on the whole now is not much better than the pre super league 1990ish semi professional days
Getting humped by 43 points by NZ on home turf with the likes of Scott Naylor in the centres, Wellens on the wing (speed demon!), Deacon at stand off, Tony Smith at hooker, Harvey Howard propping and, wait for it, Andy Hay and Darren Fleary on the bench.
That team would get obliterated by the best of 2009. Having said that, I agree that there's been some very poor games this year.
On the other hand, I think that some of the kids getting games in SL over the last few years are WAAAAAAY better than those we were seeing 8/9 years ago.
I always use this example but compare the line ups in this game of 2000 with the current line ups of wigan and bratfut for example to see how far the standard of SL has fallen due to the CC!!
The SL used to have approximately 5/6 top class teams who could match it with the best and with the NRL teams. Now the CC means each team can have no more than 2-3 WC / good players while the rest of each team are made up of mediocre poor to average players.
The result....yes a more competative league, but now in terms of the SL product the only top game that serves up any fayre is Saints V Leeds (probably due to the fact they have both circumvented the cap by using ofshore methods). The top games in SL used to be class matches, where skill, flare, fast running etc. came in droves. Any match between any two teams out of Bratfut, Wigan, Stains, Leeds, Wire, Hull etc. could almost always be guarenteed to be a classic.......Now there often pathetic games, most trys coming from errors of the less competent players, and often blow out scores to whichever one of the two teams is less 5h1t!! Look at wire v bratfut for a perfect example!!
Going back to that game I counted a total 16/17 WC players in both those line ups...compare that now between the two teams and your looking at 2/3 max!!
Yes more competitive the SL is, yet it has lost all its intensity and become a mediocre competition IMO. Those matches between the top 6 used to almost rival the intensity of the NRL....now the SL is little more intense than NL1. This years 4 nations will be even more embaressing as a result IMO!
The whole idea of the salary cap when it came in was supposed to stop teams going bust and also to improve the competition. What the CC has done though is dilute the competition massively.
What should have been done was to encourage the lesser teams to invest in acadamys, and increase their support in order to produce players of a better standard to match wigan, leeds, saints, bradford etc. and reinvest surplus monies in producing better talent, thus making the league rival the NRL for intesity and competitiveness.
What the RFL did in their infinate wisdom is rather than building from the bottom, they artificially stopped the top teams from getting stronger, and held them back to the levels of the lower clubs. THe result, a competitive but poor league - the spectacle has suffered, and with the CC in place not only is the standard of the league and players in decline, there is no incentive for any club to improve the situation, as you can compete in our poor shortsighted league on crowds of 4k and without any decent academy infrastructure, as teams like Harlequins / Huddersfield /Celtic and Wakefield are testiment to!!!
I worry for SL as I honestly think the competition on the whole now is not much better than the pre super league 1990ish semi professional days
Joined: Feb 10 2003 Posts: 21013 Location: Dog nosing
andyed-wiganrl's sig wrote:THE PROTEST PART 1 -URGING ALL WIGAN RL FANS....PLEASE DO NOT PURCHASE ANY SNACKS..DRINKS..PIES FROM THE JJB STADIUM CONCOURSE/ SOUTH STAND BAR EVER!!! BRING YOUR OWN AND HIT WHELAN WHERE IT HURTS!!!
Your campaign is going well. Biggest queue I've ever seen at the JJB snack counter on Sunday
JTB wrote:Your campaign is going well. Biggest queue I've ever seen at the JJB snack counter on Sunday
I know.........whats the point in trying to do owt eh? Sure theres more wiganers buying stuff at the ground now than ever.........not really any point is there!
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