northernbloke wrote:There seems to be an obsession that any new fans are going to come from the streets surrounding the ground.
16,000 people per Square Mile is the population density of Ealing.....a rough line drawn from Ruislip Rd East, down argyle road, along the A4020 and then back up Greenford road is probably a shade over that, but let's call it a an area populated by 16,000 people who could walk to the ground in 10 minutes.....situated in this area is Drayton Manor School (1,600 pupils), Brentside School (1,500) and just on the fringes we have Notting Hill & Ealing High School (900). There are also a number of community centres and special needs schools in this catchment area.
I would recommend to anyone trying to attract new consumers to their offering, that dropping leaflets to the 4,000/5,000 houses in this area, as well as incentivising the local schools (who will all be running fundraising activities) to help promote us would far more beneficial than a random leaflet drop in far away boroughs!
I would suggest that most fans of RL clubs other than ourselves are drawn from an area of no more than 3 miles away from their club.....Ealing isn't that dissimilar to Wakefield in terms of Population and I'd pretty much wager heavily on most fans of Wakey being a short distance from the ground.....maybe bigger Clubs like Leeds might stretch a bit further afield, but RL is a community sport and at present, our Community is Ealing Borough and specifically Hanwell, Greenford, Drayton Green and Perivale....that's where we should be concentrating, not Sheen
JESUS WEPT HOW MANY TIMES????? £20 a ticket and £15 on beer and merchandise.....so an away fan is worth £35. At best, 1,000 is the average away support split across 11 rounds and I am being really generous here, so Toronto, replacing say Wakefield will cost a SL club £35,000. The minimum turnover of a SL club is £4,000,000 so Toronto instead of Widnes is worth less than 1% of a SL clubs turnover.
There are many valid reasons for and against expansion into America, but "AWAY FANS" isn't one of them.
Dog, the difference between wakey and Ealing is history, how long have wakey been running, a lot of the fans are second third generation. Moving into an area such as Brentford twickenham Ealing with a minority sport and then suddenly expecting that community to adopt that sport just because they can walk to it is just daft. Of the schools you mention do any play rugby league? Look at our current fan base and geographic spread! And our community is Greater London not just Ealing borough
Halfdan of t'wide embrace wrote:Better shut the doors then. A few seasons ago, when Broncos averaged a few thousand, Dulwich averaged 170. On Saturday they attracted 1,266 to a game with nothing on it played, about ten miles from the their home ground as they have been evicted, at level 7 of football.
We haven't sunk to their level, we have sunk well beyond it which is why several Broncos season ticket holders were in Tooting watching that game. I was the only one of the Hamlet fans who watch Broncos in Ealing.
In a nutshell.
And we have nothing to learn from them??
Rise like Lions after slumber In unvanquishable number-- Shake your chains to earth like dew Which in sleep had fallen on you-- Ye are many -- they are few.'
It would not be too difficult for The Broncos to find out what Dulwich Hamlet are doing right. Ask their chairman. He is a Broncos fan and at most games.
Liam, DHFC Chairman, is a salaried employee of a well known company. There is no benefactor at Dulwich. I believe Liam offered to speak to the club about what Dulwich do to drive gates but got no reply.
Dulwich's Community Liaison Officer, a librarian by day, also watches Broncos occasionally and would be well worth the club talking to.
Halfdan of t'wide embrace wrote:Liam, DHFC Chairman, is a salaried employee of a well known company. There is no benefactor at Dulwich. I believe Liam offered to speak to the club about what Dulwich do to drive gates but got no reply.
Dulwich's Community Liaison Officer, a librarian by day, also watches Broncos occasionally and would be well worth the club talking to.
[NORTHERNBLOKE MODE] the bloke that Hired Gus MacKay needs no advice! The Guy who appointed "The Towell" is infallible! The Guy who got us relegated is a genius......[/NBMODE]]
JESUS WEPT HOW MANY TIMES????? £20 a ticket and £15 on beer and merchandise.....so an away fan is worth £35. At best, 1,000 is the average away support split across 11 rounds and I am being really generous here, so Toronto, replacing say Wakefield will cost a SL club £35,000. The minimum turnover of a SL club is £4,000,000 so Toronto instead of Widnes is worth less than 1% of a SL clubs turnover.
There are many valid reasons for and against expansion into America, but "AWAY FANS" isn't one of them.
Halfdan of t'wide embrace wrote:Liam, DHFC Chairman, is a salaried employee of a well known company. There is no benefactor at Dulwich. I believe Liam offered to speak to the club about what Dulwich do to drive gates but got no reply.
Dulwich's Community Liaison Officer, a librarian by day, also watches Broncos occasionally and would be well worth the club talking to.
So let me get this straight, you want someone who is worth Hundreds of Millions of pounds earned by making key business decisions to start taking advice from the Chairman of an amateur football team that happens to have a large following of hipsters because they all like to stick together and be a bit different from other soccer fans? Apart from that what is it about Dulwich Hamlet you want Broncos to follow? How to lose your ground? How to fail to get promotion from a league you're by far the biggest spenders in for the previous few seasons?
Jesus, I thought people asking for Eddie Hearn to get involved was funny!!
And what exactly would a Librarian bring to the party?
I'm genuinely lost for words as to what goes through people's heads
What do I think it would be worth taking advice on? Easy community engagement and methods of growing the gate. In a handful or years Dulwich have grown their gate from an average of 170 to around 2000 on Saturdays before they were evicted. (Most of whom are not hipsters whatever the press like to say.) Is it a directly repeatable methodology, no actually there are unique features at Dulwich that don't hold true for Broncos however much of the strategy is transferrable.
David Hughes was a very good oil trader. If I want advice on oil trading I'd approach him. If I want advice on crowd and community engagement and growing the gate I would speak to Liam and not David. Horses for courses and frankly, given the desperate gate on Saturday, what do the Broncos have to lose?
The fact Dulwich are homeless has nothing to do with this, that's due to a planning dispute totally unrelated to community relations. Dulwich are not the top spenders in the league and haven't been since promotion to that level. They have improved their league finishing position for something like eight consecutive seasons and this season finished 2nd. About right in terms of the budget. This is relevant to community relations/growing your fan base as by expanding the fan base they have expanded the budget permitting improved on field results. (Though being homeless realistically means big cuts next season.)
As to what can the Community Liaison Officer bring to the party, an immense amount actually. Gates have gone up from averaging 170 to 2,000 in a few seasons. Do you honestly think 1800 people happened to blunder through the turnstiles and decided they liked it. Of course not, Dulwich actively went out and recruited a new fan base. This was no fluke, a lot of hard work went into it. The lead person in that process was the Community Liaison Officer. He knows exactly which approaches worked and which failed. Why would you not want to tap into that knowledge?
Frankly the approach that a librarian can't possibly bring anything to the party sums up exactly why Broncos are in a mess. Learn from people who have been there and done it, especially when they were offering the knowledge for free. Feel free to list everyone in the UK who has a better track record at driving community relations and turning that into ground visits which in turn drove repeat visits and then people inviting their friends who invited their friends because the club had the offering on and off the pitch right and people enjoyed it in recent seasons. Then draw up a second list, removing all the paid professionals who are beyond our reach. The remaining list will be very short indeed. But hey, he's a librarian so what does he know.......
I can tell you now the first bit of advice would have been don't run random leaflet drops like Broncos did on Saturday. Target the approaches to the community as they way you can measure and contrast responses. Another bit of advice, further down the line NOT now as it has to be right on and off the pitch to hook people, if RFL rules permit run a pay what you want for admission day. One of the key days in DHFC's recent history was the first pay what you want day. Community relations anr awareness had grown thanks to our librarian. People were open to coming but not at a tenner to try it out. (A bigger issue for Broncos at 20.) The club had the offering right off the pitch, on the pitch you need a bit of luck. Many people attended their first Hamlet game, a fair chunk their first football game. Many enjoyed it and came back and, as mentioned, started inviting their friends. A personal invitation from someone you know and trust is worth a million free or cheap offer flyers. It's not rocket science, hard work, a little money and a bit of luck are required.
Edited to say I despair of any rugby league club who aren't tapping into York for advice at the moment. They are doing impressive things too. Again it's not 100% transferrable but much of it will be.
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