Joined: Mar 04 2005 Posts: 5880 Location: Bradford
amberavenger wrote:Farce is - to me - a harsh summation when it's probably the most "sensible" way of promoting to SL in well over a decade compared to the last few systems of 8s, and franchising/no promotion at all.
This system guarantees promotion to SL - not so under the 8s, although the only year a team has failed to go up was the year we were in the MPG! - and guarantees it's earned on the pitch.
The last time there was regular promotion/relegation from the Championship it was a playoff final system, and that seemed to go ok.
I don't see why this division needs its own playoff system and grand final. It is literally nothing more than a money spinner.
If you can play through the whole season and finish top of the league then you've earned your place in SL imo. You shouldn't need to also come out on top of a sudden death playoff system where a few injuries or general bad luck could scupper things. Imagine if a team finishes in fifth but makes a couple of signings right before the deadline, and then goes on to win the GF. I think that's what JK might see as being a bit farcical.
It's been a grounds such as Warrington, Widnes and Headingley. Some pretty decent crowds too. If its done right, it could be a massive occasion - imagine us playing Widnes for a place in SL at Headingley with 20K there? That's not a pipe dream - see the crowds in that link above.
Wigan Bull wrote:Where will the GF of it be played? At the home of the highest placed club?
It's been a grounds such as Warrington, Widnes and Headingley. Some pretty decent crowds too. If its done right, it could be a massive occasion - imagine us playing Widnes for a place in SL at Headingley with 20K there? That's not a pipe dream - see the crowds in that link above.
Nothus wrote:I don't see why this division needs its own playoff system and grand final. It is literally nothing more than a money spinner.
If you can play through the whole season and finish top of the league then you've earned your place in SL imo. You shouldn't need to also come out on top of a sudden death playoff system where a few injuries or general bad luck could scupper things. Imagine if a team finishes in fifth but makes a couple of signings right before the deadline, and then goes on to win the GF. I think that's what JK might see as being a bit farcical.
The top team of the Championship hasn't been automatically promoted for two decades. Not sure why it's suddenly a problem now - the imagined scenario described was literally every year of the system we've just had except a top 4 and not 5. I don't think there were too many crying off when we had a crack at the Million Pound Game despite Leigh finishing top. See also Torronto this year who will be in no worse position if they top the table in 2019.
If everyone knows the rules before it kicks off (a rarity in this sport, I know!) then everyone has the same opportunity. I understand the argument, but "farcical" is a bit OTT to my mind when you consider the complete absurdity the second tier teams have had to overcome since franchising came in.
Joined: Mar 07 2005 Posts: 4065 Location: Brisbane
amberavenger wrote:The top team of the Championship hasn't been automatically promoted for two decades. Not sure why it's suddenly a problem now - the imagined scenario described was literally every year of the system we've just had except a top 4 and not 5. I don't think there were too many crying off when we had a crack at the Million Pound Game despite Leigh finishing top. See also Torronto this year who will be in no worse position if they top the table in 2019.
If everyone knows the rules before it kicks off (a rarity in this sport, I know!) then everyone has the same opportunity. I understand the argument, but "farcical" is a bit OTT to my mind when you consider the complete absurdity the second tier teams have had to overcome since franchising came in.
Joined: Dec 07 2006 Posts: 4035 Location: Waiting for an announcement...
amberavenger wrote:The top team of the Championship hasn't been automatically promoted for two decades. Not sure why it's suddenly a problem now - the imagined scenario described was literally every year of the system we've just had except a top 4 and not 5. I don't think there were too many crying off when we had a crack at the Million Pound Game despite Leigh finishing top. See also Torronto this year who will be in no worse position if they top the table in 2019.
If everyone knows the rules before it kicks off (a rarity in this sport, I know!) then everyone has the same opportunity. I understand the argument, but "farcical" is a bit OTT to my mind when you consider the complete absurdity the second tier teams have had to overcome since franchising came in.
Correct, plus a top 5 playoff system is much for helpful for us than say Toronto. Toronto should be top easily next year IMO, and a straight one up system would lead to the Championship season fizzling out for all the mid table teams. But as it is, I suspect the fight to get in the top 5 will go down to the last week, and there's no reason why we shouldn't look to get in the mix for pushing for that 5th spot. Then we're in with a shot via the playoffs. Highly unlikely we'll go up, but to be even in with a shot next year would be awesome. I think the top 5 system was always my favourite one, if they implement it like we had it back around 2001 when coming top gave you two home chances to make the final, so finishing top of the league still meant something (unlike saints in this years SL where 1 bad game sees them gone despite being the best team all year.)
It's been a grounds such as Warrington, Widnes and Headingley. Some pretty decent crowds too. If its done right, it could be a massive occasion - imagine us playing Widnes for a place in SL at Headingley with 20K there? That's not a pipe dream - see the crowds in that link above.
Quite! I think Warrington's ground lends itself to this type of occasion ans no reason it couldn't be a sell out with the right teams in the final! What's the capacity there now?
paulwalker71 wrote:No, history shows it has been at a neutral venue
It's been a grounds such as Warrington, Widnes and Headingley. Some pretty decent crowds too. If its done right, it could be a massive occasion - imagine us playing Widnes for a place in SL at Headingley with 20K there? That's not a pipe dream - see the crowds in that link above.
Quite! I think Warrington's ground lends itself to this type of occasion ans no reason it couldn't be a sell out with the right teams in the final! What's the capacity there now?
Joined: Aug 01 2012 Posts: 964 Location: A floating palace of ignorance
amberavenger wrote:The top team of the Championship hasn't been automatically promoted for two decades. Not sure why it's suddenly a problem now - the imagined scenario described was literally every year of the system we've just had except a top 4 and not 5. I don't think there were too many crying off when we had a crack at the Million Pound Game despite Leigh finishing top. See also Torronto this year who will be in no worse position if they top the table in 2019.
If everyone knows the rules before it kicks off (a rarity in this sport, I know!) then everyone has the same opportunity. I understand the argument, but "farcical" is a bit OTT to my mind when you consider the complete absurdity the second tier teams have had to overcome since franchising came in.
Didn't the Champ and Champ1 clubs suggest a solution where it was straight up/down for the top/bottom clubs, and then the 2-5 placed clubs in the Champ play a knockout to play a one-off Million pound game with the SL 2nd from bottom team?
That would keep the excitement of the MPG and keep competition alive, while keeping a promotion/relegation AND leaving things to play for too.
Of course the SL clubs poo-poohed it. And brought in repeat fixures instead; as that's MUCH more thrilling.
Never trust a man who, when left alone in a room with a tea cosy, doesn't try it on.
Joined: Dec 22 2001 Posts: 32126 Location: The Corridor of Uncertainty
We've got to get into the top 5 first. I think Toronto, Widnes, Toulouse and Halifax have the top 4 pretty much nailed on with Fev not far off but possibly weaker after having to make cuts due to them missing out this year. There is a definite drop in quality after that top 5. I expect Leigh to drop down a bit with their troubles.
We may take time to get used to the rise in quality. The "easiest" opposition will be sides that gave us our hardest games this season so we'll need to step it up. Hopefully a proper pre season and a few new guys with proven championship quality will help.
"If you start listening to the fans it won't be long before you're sitting with them," - Wayne Bennett.
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